A Wild Knifecat Appears! (Rengar Discussion)

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RakshirX

Member

09-07-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarizard View Post
Heal on kill isn't Trundle's Passive...Trundle's Passive is just heal on death u.u

Also, not going to put anything crazy like Stealth on it. This is an 800g item that is giving you Attack Damage, Butcher Passive and upgrades into champion-specific bonuses. For what it's doing, it's pretty cheap...which is why i'll reiterate again that whatever the passive comes out to be will be a minor, yet useful passive that A. appeals to laning Rengar in the early phases of the game, and B. Has a secondary synergy with jungle rengar.

So yeah, expect whatever 2nd passive makes it onto his BTN to be tiny, but useful. (The reason i keep bringing up Doran's Items is their passives far outlive their statistical usefulness, and don't feel poor as item choices regardless of their lack of buildpath.)
I think the answer is some 'on hit' healing, like dorans. Why not give it a small % life leech? This will make it applicable to junglers and laners, but still be minor enough to not be a 'must have' item, giving him some sustain in jungle and on top. 5% of 60dmg is only 3 health per hit, just a small boost to keep him going in the jungle, and top laning. Another idea would simply be some health regen' per tic. You're the master here though, so we bow to your expertise.


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The Dunkmaster

Senior Member

09-07-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Griever1944 View Post
http://www.lolking.net/champions/ren...ond#statistics

50% winrate on average, low popularity, am i missing something about his Kit or did decent players already figure how to counter it?
His KIT is broken.


Only CDs restrict him, double cast (hence why leblanc is anti-fun to play against) no counterplay, oracles doesn't help because you're dead as he leaps on you.

Huge burst, tankiness, hard CC, long stealth, crazy leap passive.

That doesn't sound broken to you?


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RakshirX

Member

09-07-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dunkmaster View Post
His KIT is broken.


Only CDs restrict him, double cast (hence why leblanc is anti-fun to play against) no counterplay, oracles doesn't help because you're dead as he leaps on you.

Huge burst, tankiness, hard CC, long stealth, crazy leap passive.

That doesn't sound broken to you?
Pink wards easily counter him, as does buying armor, and he has only 1 slow or short root - this is not 'hard CC', he is not tanky, and if he gets caught, he is easily killed. Stop whining, he's been ultra-uber-nerfed for far too long - go buy some armor and some pink wards ya freakin' sissy.


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lm Krueger ml

Senior Member

09-07-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarizard View Post
Also, not going to put anything crazy like Stealth on it. This is an 800g item that is giving you Attack Damage, Butcher Passive and upgrades into champion-specific bonuses. For what it's doing, it's pretty cheap...which is why i'll reiterate again that whatever the passive comes out to be will be a minor, yet useful passive that A. appeals to laning Rengar in the early phases of the game, and B. Has a secondary synergy with jungle rengar.

So yeah, expect whatever 2nd passive makes it onto his BTN to be tiny, but useful. (The reason i keep bringing up Doran's Items is their passives far outlive their statistical usefulness, and don't feel poor as item choices regardless of their lack of buildpath.)
Are you not wanting it to scale? So percentile numbers are out?

I'd personally prefer seeing a heal based on: percentage of Rengars missing health; percentage of Rengars max health; percentage of enemies max health; etc.

Depending on what exact effect you were going for could switch it up a bit. My concern is that a flat heal will only be useful for early game. Then we have effective value being factored into the BTN's power cost that is just falling off completely...


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lm Krueger ml

Senior Member

09-07-2013

Also just a thought:

If you want to make BTN more attractive to a LaneGar can you not just alter the way trophies are collected?

What if it was:

- minion and small monster Trophy are worth 1 point
- siege minion and large monster Trophy are worth 5 points
- player and epic monster Trophy are worth 25 points

BTN bonuses are given at 75/150/225/350 Trophy Points.


I mean its not quite as clean, but you could tweak numbers. But the idea being that a LaneGar can still gain his stacks farming so doesn't feel so bad about building the item early if he wants it.


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GrieverXIII

Senior Member

09-07-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dunkmaster View Post
His KIT is broken.


Only CDs restrict him, double cast (hence why leblanc is anti-fun to play against) no counterplay, oracles doesn't help because you're dead as he leaps on you.

Huge burst, tankiness, hard CC, long stealth, crazy leap passive.

That doesn't sound broken to you?
The only part you got right is the Huge Burst, because outside of his double Q Rengar pretty much relies purely on auto-swing damage, W does nothing unless maxed, same for E and you are pretty much forced to max Q if you want any killing potentials. Burst damage is KIND of the point of an ASSASSIN.

Rengar is easily the squishiest jungler. Seriously he's in ****ing paper. A 1 seconds root ISN'T an hard CC, specially since you need to sacrifice TONS of damage to get it off. His leap passive is really easy to avoid, its called PLAY SMART.


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Swyteh

Junior Member

09-07-2013

Any thoughts on when he's gonna appear on the PBE?


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Siky

Senior Member

09-07-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarizard View Post
It's not as good, but you also would sometime get ~50+ for killing golems, or siege minions. Or you could just build both :P

Like i said, throwing a number out. I don't suspect i'll put 5 in for testing, but something around the numbers Doran's items have is what i'm looking for.
I don't know how you feel about this, but what about a stackable heal that is consumed when his Q is used or something (since he literally stabs something and the Q particle effect is like a blood spray).

Thirst for Blood
Passive: Killing a monster or minion gives Rengar 1 stack of Thirst for Blood, large minions grants Renger 5 stacks of Thirst for Blood. When Rengar attacks with Savagery, he consumes all stacks, healing himself for 5 health per stack. Loses all stacks on death.

More or less strictly a laning passive, less useful in the jungle. Rather than for low level sustain, if he jumps at someone with a lot of stacks, the burst heal could surprise them. Maybe have a limit? If a Rengar can kill 100 minions without Q I would just say he's earned the 500 health burst heal he's going to get.


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NA Darklarik

Senior Member

09-07-2013

Scarizard, big question: Will BTN get a Late-lategame upgrade? You know when the game gets to the point where your either fed enough or it drags on long enough that you get all 6 items, and sometimes BTN just dosent feel like such a great catch in vs some of the more expensive items.

Long and short, will it get another upgrade? Like BTN+Pickax or some other item combine into something with a 2000 Gold total (Like the spirit items) and finish as a more solid item that CAN snowball? That way, if things go south, the item dosent feel like a bad investment?


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lightdragoon88

Senior Member

09-07-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swyteh View Post
Any thoughts on when he's gonna appear on the PBE?

He posted that he is aiming for patch 3.13