Demacia Needs Heroes

First Riot Post
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SplendidSorrow

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torvin Augeri View Post
Some constructive feedback for the Parrot.



I find all of the above to be valid. That said, I feel that there is some rather abrupt dissonance here between the character/lore as outlined here by the journal pages and the visual design of this concept.

Particularly, there’s this bit here:



Thing is, I don’t see utility when I look at the only picture we currently have of her. I don’t see pockets, I don’t see a belt, I don’t see a bag. Maybe those are there on the final design, maybe not. As far as the concept goes, while I do see knee pads and a lack of exposed flesh, there remains the matter of said dissonance. If it wasn’t for the bolt pistol and Valor giving her away as a ranger and falconer, her get-up would make me think melee-ranged skirmisher.

Quinn’s concept also suffers from the same problem that Ashe, Tryndamere, and Sejuani suffer, which is to say there’s a disconnect between their appearance and their background. The Freljordians are supposedly from a cold, harsh tundra atop the mountains, and yet I take one look at them and go, “Why are they wearing such skimpy garments? Wouldn’t they be freezing?” Likewise with Quinn, except in her case it’s, “Why is she running around with greaves on? Isn’t that impractical?” I look at her armor in the concept and it comes off as metallic where I’d expect and hope to see leather or some variation on hide. Instead, all of the gold is stiff- and rigid-looking. Seriously, go on a days-long hike and then come back and tell me you’d like to go through that again while weighed down like that. For some commoner who has to track down, outpace, and catch an assassin – assassins are slippery little gits – she doesn’t look the part. Rather, she looks like she’s about to attend some Demacian function. And I know you’re going to hate hearing this, but she has heels. Not stilettos, thankfully, but wedges. I was hoping for boots. You know, practical for traipsing through the woods.

Heavy armor is more suited to archers than to rangers. The former spends much of his or her time in fortified positions, such as atop castle walls; the latter is more concerned with mobility, pathfinding, tracking, roughing it. Simply put, Quinn looks more like a Demacian superhero than a ranger - which would be fine, if we hadn’t been treated to the journal pages. I almost wish I’d only had one or the other now, rather than both – just the pages, or just the picture. As it stands, I find it hard to believe that she could catch anyone off guard dressed like that, and that’s what it comes down to, same as Sejuani: suspension of disbelief gets thrown out the window because it’s a little too over-the-top.

It’s a damned shame, too, because I LIKE the design. Reminds me of Lenneth from Valkyrie Profile.

I have a hard time believing you read the journal entries and Iron stylus's post.

First off, she's in the elite guard so to speak. Elite units, in fantasy realms at least, tend to have armor that is both functional and decorative. This is not a disconnect this is how it is.

Secondly, the 'lack of pockets' Its really hard to tell what kind of pockets she has from such a small picture. Are there pockets on her hips there? Behind her? Who knows we can't see.

As a third point rangers are not always ranged combatants. The look of a melee skirmisher is not an inacurate one. Remember Aragorn was a Ranger (you know from the series of books which spawned D&D and such where the ranger was born as an idea) and he was a melee skirmisher.

Continuing on, archers didn't wear heavy armor. Armor restricts movement, which restricts archery. Crossbowmen could wear more armor because their weapon allowed it, archers on the other hand have a much harder time wearing it.

In the end think of the shiney silver armor as a 'parade uniform' (not that it ever matters in a fantasy realm). More to the point, this will be the uniform she wears on the fields of justice where she's representing her country...not just stomping around in the woods. Also you'll notice no dirt on anything, do you really think thats the way she would look after a while in the wilderness?

Come on...use your brain.


Beyond all that consider this is a artist rendition of her in which he captures the ideal, the essence of the character, the fact that she's not just a grunt any more, she's a member of the elite guard, that she's prety much been taken under Jarvan's wing...That she's got a giant bird the size of her torso and head resting on her arm, which already has a heavy peice of metal on it and has no problems keeping it like that.......

Seriously...and you complain that she doesn't looked like a ranger (false), doesn't have enough pockets (who the hell can tell?), has too much armor (uh really?), and doesn't look like she can sneak up on anyone (kidding me right?)...but you completely skip over the fact she has a bird that looks like its at least half her weight...on an outstretched armored arm, and having no problems with it....


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Hamburger Hooves

Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raygr View Post
More like people wanted Quinn to look more like a ranger/tracker then a knight. Can't assume everyone is about the boobs now. I was one of them but as I look over it and think on it. I'm for this new look. If anything this save Quinn from looking like one of Ashes skins.
That was one of my biggest fears, but I had faith that the parrot would deliver something new to the ranger genre, and I was right to believe in the mighty parrot.


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Rawfury0424

Junior Member

02-13-2013

She looks amazing. Was already interested before but im more intrigued now to play her and she how she turns out. Im ready to buy her

Amazing art, curious to see her skin on her release too(if there is one)


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InXplotch

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Hey @IronStylus, how hard was it to prevent yourself from making quinn have relation to leona and diana? Did the idea ever come up in development?


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StationaryObject

Senior Member

02-13-2013

I've been wanting to write something for Quinn since I started reading the pieces. I couldn't figure out what to write though. So when I finally saw the art work and read a few of the threads regarding her armor, I decided I would leave my impression of her armor in story form.

From what I've seen of the armor, I am left with the impression that the only metal armor on her body would be her boots, knee guards/leg guards, shoulder armor, the metal at her waist, and the wrist guard/perch. After looking at her pants, I think that she is wearing a bodysuit underneath and the baggy material is just connected to the metal around her legs and is just there to hold the pieces together. I think this because the straps at the top of the brown material seem pointless otherwise. Think of it like a fireman putting on his uniform, except the uniform stops at the bottom of her pelvis. Like additional pants, but better. THIS IS ONLY MY IMPRESSION. I don't think I'm correct, but I wanted to write it that way.

---

Quinn watched him as he climbed the steps. Prince Jarvan still baffled her. He was the opposite of everything she had thought. His steps were smooth and confident but not arrogant, reminding her of the soldiers she had seen as a child, marching though the city.

They reached the top of the stairs and Prince Jarvan lead her down a hallway and finally stopped in front of a door. He turned the knob, pushing the door open to reveal a spacious room.

"This will be your room from now on."

His tone easily implied that she shouldn't try to fight him on this. This room would be her's and there was no room for argument.

She slowly stepped into the room, her eyes quickly scanning the open space before she determined that no one would be jumping out at her. The colors were easy on her eyes, light brown walls and similar carpeting easily reminded her of the woods and the forest.

Reminded her of Caleb.

She shut her eyes and clenched her hands, forcing the thought away. She wouldn't ruin this day with such painful thoughts. She deserved a day free of guilt.

"Should you require anything, let one of the servants know. They will accommodate you," Prince Jarvan said behind her. She nodded and refused to look behind her till the door closed.

Letting out the breathe she didn't notice she was holding, she spotted a window and quickly raced over, popping it open. The cool breeze hit her and she felt the tension drain from her body. As she propped the window completely open, she spotted Valor circling above the building and raised her arm.

Valor circled once more before he swooped down and entered the window, bypassing Quinn's arm entirely to take perch on a nearby chair.
"You silly thing. Chairs are not perches." Valor just looked at her and she sighed in mock disgust, "Fine, you can stay there all night. However, do not complain to me when you wake up and your poor claws hurt."

Receiving no reply, Quinn stepped away from the window and stretched. Now that the tension was gone, she didn't feel so weighed down, so paranoid that someone would jump out from the shadows and slit her throat. Valor was by her side again and she was safe.

Out of the corner of her eyes, she spotted folded clothes sitting on the room's bed. The beige material looked more comfortable than her dirt covered leathers. The more she thought about her current clothes, the more she desired to get out of them.

Getting out of skin-tight leathers always had the chance of slipping off easy... or forcing her to make a complete fool of herself by skipping around on one foot while trying to pry the material off the other. It took some time, but she was pleased to announce that she didn't fall once.

The leather pants now laid on the pristine white sheets and she took into account the damage the material had sustained in the fight and that they wouldn't be repairable. Her jacket was salvageable, but only barely. She'd have to get rid of the sleeves entirely...

She slipped on the roomy pants, enjoying the loose material. If she had to wear pants ever again, she was going to wear nice and loose material. Sure, tight leggings always got the job done, but sometimes the leathers toughened in the middle of a journey and that was not easy to run it.
As she slipped her over-shirt off, she stopped to think. What would they have her wear now?

She wasn't so naive that she believed they would let her slip away, back into the wilderness were she truly belonged. No, they would keep her close. She was given a place among the Demacian Elite, something no one just turned down.

Grabbing her bag, she slid into the unoccupied chair and opened her sketch book to an empty page. She took the pencil first, slowly drawing a figure. She added hair and a face similar to what she thought she looked like. Several attempts later, she was pleased with the base model and sat back, pencil on her lips, and thought about what she would want to look like.

Comfortable was her first thought and she smirked. Sketching on some baggy pants, she laughed at what she had drawn and quickly erased the outfit.

Valor raised on his wings, preening the feathers. She had always admired the beauty that Valor had, the sleek graceful look of his wings and tail.
She watched him, taking in the shape of his feathers and their arrangement. She would want to look like Valor. She wanted to honor him, to emphasize him. He was a part of her as much as her weapons, and if she had the chance to make her own armor, she would make sure he had a part in it.

She sketched out a small cloak, the ends mimicking his wing feathers. She also added a perch for him on an out-stretched arm, something that would allow him to land easily and take off from. She added in mock tail tail feathers to the outfit. It would match the cloak in color, she thought as she pulled out a blue inked pen she carried. The blue carried over into armor for her legs. The leg armor would be in two pieces, she decided. They would attach to a belt at her waist and would cover her legs. Her hips would have armor that moved, that shifted against each other. Nothing restrictive, but something that would give her some protection to her hips and waist. The armor would be connected by material that would lay on top of a body suit perhaps. The bodysuit underneath would give her the movement that she required, but the armor on top would give her the protection she needed.

The material would reach her knees and connect with knee guards. She sketched them pointed, much like Valor's beak. She looked over at Valor and laughed to herself, well maybe not exactly like Valor's beak...

She didn't know how long she had been sketching till a knock on her door pulled her out of her head. She had to blink for a moment before calling out, "Come in."

A servant woman opened the door and gave a deep bow, "My Lady, if you would please come with me, the bathing area is ready for you."
My lady? Quinn snorted to herself, much to the shock of the servant, but followed the servant out, none the less.

It wasn't too long after they left the room that another knock sounded. After a few moments, the door was opened to reveal Prince Jarvan, who swept the room with a glance. His eyes didn't see Quinn, but they caught on the scraps of paper that littered the table. He thought for a moment about the privacy of woman, but quickly abandoned the thought to his curiosity. A report perhaps?

It wasn't a report that sat on the table, but a sketch. A sketch of a rather unique looking set of armor that was worn by the newly famous Quinn herself. On her arm, sat her regal Valor.

"Prince Jarvan," a voice called from the doorway. Still holding the sketch, Jarvan turned to see the tailor he had instructed to meet him. Looking back at the sketch in his hand, he made his decision and smiled to himself.

Exiting the room, he gave the sketch to the tailor, "Send this to the Armor-smith."

The tailor looked at the sketch in his hands and set a questioning look to his prince, "Sir?"

"I want it done and ready for Quinn by the end of the week. Don't disappoint me."

With a gulp, the tailor nodded, "As my prince wishes."

--
FORGIVE ME FOR THE LENGTH.


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Finch Toast

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Strap in.
You Parrot you!


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harshdefender

Junior Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
You're doing just the right amount of analysis.

Demacia needs form language and motifs that aren't just generic medieval. Champions aren't the only things that will evolve. The city-states are going to take on more distinct looks as well that deviate from traditional fantasy.

Strap in.
I don't know why but this just made me do a ****load of thinking of how much freedom you guys have with champion design, using the lore as a driving force for it. I haven't read much of the lore before this so I may be bringing up what is already known, but using these journal pages for Quinn shapes her into whatever you guys want. I think it would be interesting if you used champions already in the game to reveal newer champions. Say, for example, a long battle is being waged between Demacia and Noxus. You could have Garen and Darius send letters to their superiors of how the battle is going, and it would be very formal due to the recipient. But then you could have their journal entries (because men have journals too) of how they feel a certain pressure on the battlefield, increasing every time someone falls...and then BAM, a long forgotten evil arises, fueled by the bloodshed, and champions can be released based on this evil...I dunno, just food for thought, I'm bored and waiting for Quinn on the PBE, okay? Don't judge, I wanna bird stuff and shoot stuff and kick stuff and bird stuff some more.


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Orikan

Senior Member

02-13-2013

Ironstylus. Is it just me, or does her armor look a bit reminiscent of Talon's cape? Was this on purpose?


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Emperor Z19

Senior Member

02-13-2013

I'm usually not too big on human champions (I generally prefer bestial, monstrous, yordle, or otherwise strange characters), but I'm digging Quinn's design, it has a lot of dignity and flare. It kinda looks like something from Fire Emblem.

I prefer my females to be badasses more than boobs & asses, so, assuming I like her kit, I'll be picking her up a week after her release.


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Hamburger Hooves

Member

02-13-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by SplendidSorrow View Post
I have a hard time believing you read the journal entries and Iron stylus's post.

First off, she's in the elite guard so to speak. Elite units, in fantasy realms at least, tend to have armor that is both functional and decorative. This is not a disconnect this is how it is.

Secondly, the 'lack of pockets' Its really hard to tell what kind of pockets she has from such a small picture. Are there pockets on her hips there? Behind her? Who knows we can't see.

As a third point rangers are not always ranged combatants. The look of a melee skirmisher is not an inacurate one. Remember Aragorn was a Ranger (you know from the series of books which spawned D&D and such where the ranger was born as an idea) and he was a melee skirmisher.

Continuing on, archers didn't wear heavy armor. Armor restricts movement, which restricts archery. Crossbowmen could wear more armor because their weapon allowed it, archers on the other hand have a much harder time wearing it.

In the end think of the shiney silver armor as a 'parade uniform' (not that it ever matters in a fantasy realm). More to the point, this will be the uniform she wears on the fields of justice where she's representing her country...not just stomping around in the woods. Also you'll notice no dirt on anything, do you really think thats the way she would look after a while in the wilderness?

Come on...use your brain.


Beyond all that consider this is a artist rendition of her in which he captures the ideal, the essence of the character, the fact that she's not just a grunt any more, she's a member of the elite guard, that she's prety much been taken under Jarvan's wing...That she's got a giant bird the size of her torso and head resting on her arm, which already has a heavy peice of metal on it and has no problems keeping it like that.......

Seriously...and you complain that she doesn't looked like a ranger (false), doesn't have enough pockets (who the hell can tell?), has too much armor (uh really?), and doesn't look like she can sneak up on anyone (kidding me right?)...but you completely skip over the fact she has a bird that looks like its at least half her weight...on an outstretched armored arm, and having no problems with it....

I agree with you but would like to add one point: When she went off after Talon/The Assassin, she wasn't an elite guard or anything more then a scout/ranger/soldier. She wouldn't have access to the money that armor would have cost her. So when she went out to do her batman impression, she was probably only wearing light leather armor pockets and her crossbow, which even then would probably be a smaller more portable version. It'll probably be a skin sooner or later.