+3 +2 +1 ... -17 why riot why

First Riot Post
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swindlemellons

Member

02-04-2013


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JarlaxelBaenre

Senior Member

02-04-2013

I'm in exact same boat at Division I. won 8 straight got to 94, then lost 1 and went down to 74. Don't feel like playing anymore, pretty sure this new ranking system killed the game for me.

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...1#post34274603

My thread, people just laugh at me and say "you aren't good enough for silver"


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Jerriescids

Senior Member

02-04-2013

My experience:

11-2-7 W -- (team raged 90% of the game in chat)
13-4-6 W -- (team raged 90% of the game in chat)
8-5-5 L -- (0-12 morde, doesn't talk then afks)
15-5-16 L -- (Demoted at this point from III to IV 50LP)
10-5-6 W -- (team raged 90% of the game in chat)
14-2-12 W
10-4-13 W -- (Put into Placement)
3-5-2 L -- (Troll Match)
16-2-8 W -- (amazing match, Loved it. Best out of all 12. No one that mad.)
14-5-8 L -- (Double ADC carry pick, massive chat rage, team would not just play)

Overall: 114-39-83

Overall Score 8-4, Resulted Demotion and -24LP (From Silver 3 to Silver 4 76)


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JarlaxelBaenre

Senior Member

02-04-2013

Give me my Elo back?


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Just A Game Brah

Senior Member

02-04-2013

It's a known issue in DI. The only thing remain to be seen is how a group of people that have acted so defensively on this forum about their broken system will fix it.

I hope they fix it in 28 days before LP starts to decay (I think).

Funny how there are so many threads on this, and there is not a single sticky post with an explanation.


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Tbird

Senior Member

02-04-2013

bump


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Zydion

Associate Software Engineer

02-04-2013
1 of 6 Riot Posts

I believe Yegg has explained this many times, but I'll try to explain again.

The LP clamping that happens at Division I is due to your MMR being much lower than needed to be in the next tier, as tiers earned are permanent. So in order for the system to be sure that you belong in the next tier, it'll clamp your LP gains when you are close to promotional series to make sure that you can consistently win your games and not just due to a lucky streak.

If you keep winning more than you lose (aka your MMR slowly moves up to the expected level for the next tier), the clamping will go away. Unfortunately, the current implementation makes you feel like you are closer to the promotion that you actually are, then it suddenly slaps you in the face by clamping your LP gain when you reach 90+ in Div I. They have already eased the clamping since Leagues came out and I believe Yegg and his team are working on a smoother LP gain so you can have a better gauge at how far you are from an actual promotion instead of losing more LP than you gain when the clamping happens.

To give you guys a clearer picture of this, I'll use my personal experience from this weekend.
I was 1900 seaon 2, and about 1730 in s3 when Leagues happened. I was placed in Gold Div I.
At first, I was gaining anywhere form 17-25 LP from a win and losing about the same amount unless I had a leaver on my team which made me lose less LP than usual (new system compensates for leaves). Which means that in 4-5 wins I'd be at 100 LP playing my promotional series. However, when I reached around 85 LP, I was suddenly gaining around 3 LP instead.

I agree it felt bad at the time that when I thought I only need one more win to get my promo series instead turned into possibly 5 more straight wins. I got to about 96 LP then lost a game and dropped back down to about 80, wiping a bunch of wins that I acquired. You bet I felt discouraged at the time too. But if you think about it, I was trying to permanently qualify for Plat tier. Assuming 1850 is plat, and my MMR was at 1730 when I started. After 5 wins and 2 loses, with max of 14 Elo per win and losing 11 in the ideal case, my MMR would only sitting at 1778 yet I was already at 85 LP. If I gained the same amount without the clamping I'd only need one more game to qualify for promo series, but in the old Elo system, I'd have needed (1850-1778)/14=6 straight wins and the Plat earned wouldn't even be permanent!!! (keep in mind all the values are in the absolute ideal situation too, I'd possible need more wins in reality) So it became clear to me why I was being clamping and only gaining 3 LP. It was because my MMR was too far from the expected MMR. So in order to permanently earn the Plat tier, I needed to prove myself.

After understanding that, I just kept playing, expecting to have at least 6 wins over loses for the system to no longer clamp me. However, after hovering a couple times around 90LP (losing more than gaining of course), I qualified for my series from winning one game after dropping to 85 LP. I gained 15 LP from that game, which I assumed since I was winning more than I lost, the clamping went away. I eventually went on to winning my series 3-2 now I'm in Plat Div 5. You could tell how tense I was in the last game when Sivir was 0-7 and Teemo was 0-5 and I was losing top. But no one raged and eventually we pulled through and won. It was a great game and the plat now feels well earned knowing that I won't lose it.

Hopefully this clears it up for you guys and give you a little more hope about the new system. I agree the way it's implemented right now can make you feel discouraged because it kinda gives you a false sense of hope then suddenly takes it away. But rest assured it is much better than the volatile Elo system before IMO.


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My R Key Broke

Senior Member

02-04-2013

curious how many rioters play in silver or bronze division for extensive periods of time.


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Voidgolem

Senior Member

02-04-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zydion View Post
If you keep winning more than you lose (aka your MMR slowly moves up to the expected level for the next tier), the clamping will go away
Bold'd for emphasis, since the common GD-goer probably will gloss over that :S


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Awaen

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Senior Member

02-04-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zydion View Post
I believe Yegg has explained this many times, but I'll try to explain again.

The LP clamping that happens at Division I is due to your MMR being much lower than needed to be in the next tier, as tiers earned are permanent. So in order for the system to be sure that you belong in the next tier, it'll clamp your LP gains when you are close to promotional series to make sure that you can consistently win your games and not just due to a lucky streak.
So, just for my clarification when I try to explain this.

If your MMR is approximately equal your league placement, you should be seeing similar LP gain/losses (Other then the tier clamping) per game.

If your MMR is higher then your league placement, you should be seeing large win values, smaller loss values, as its trying to move you up.

If your MMR is lower then your league placement, you should be seeing low win values, high loss values, as its trying to move you down.


Roughly speaking, that is, I know there are conditions on division/tier steps.