What features of the proposed system do you find helpful:

Ability to report for actions during champ select 125 56.82%
Ability to kick unruly/trolling players 161 73.18%
Not having to dodge in these situations 97 44.09%
Not having to play in these situations 97 44.09%
None 27 12.27%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 220. You may not vote on this poll

Vote to Kick: The Definitive Solution

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fishnchipsmate

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Senior Member

12-24-2012

sorry, there was only one problem i ever had with vote kick systems, are you saying that someone whose kicked should receive the dodge penalty or not?


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Vanitius

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Member

12-24-2012

Show me where it says this? Being a Jerk is a punishable offense. Not playing a role you can't play or don't want to is not being a Jerk.

The Summoners Code, Section I, paragraph 2. You're welcome.

So if there is no punishment, if anyone doesn't like their team comp they will just troll to get kicked out in away. If there is a punishment then it leads back. The 4 first picks will get what they want and the last person will get kicked if he doesn't conform. Or Kicked if he doesn't play to the meta.

There is no immediate punishment. And I noted the possibility of punishing those who falsely accuse. But again it takes 3 to kick. If 3 people agree you should be kicked, you don't want to play with them anyway.

You try it in normals, then if you think its viable and you play it well and will give you a good chance to win, you take it to rankeds. It might work for you and you might know it well. You will still get kicked and banned.

I promise you're not so creative you're gonna come up with something no one has seen before. Leave that to SivHD. This whole playing outside the meta thing is the only real situation a see as being problematic, to your credit, you've found a hole. Albeit a small, nigh unnoticeable hole.

But again, you don't stray too far from the meta in ranked. The meta is the meta for a reason. You can take that up with the pros.


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Vanitius

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12-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by fishnchipsmate View Post
sorry, there was only one problem i ever had with vote kick systems, are you saying that someone whose kicked should receive the dodge penalty or not?
Originally I said no, I still say no, but I'm examining the relative merits of both sides.

A troll who keeps trolling will keep getting kicked.

Someone falsely kicked should be able to play again.

So in my mind, maybe a 5 minute dodge timer would be fine, just so you don't get matched up with someone who kicked you before, that would be a toxic situation. But more than that I'd have to go with no.

Waiting 5 minutes isn't that big a deal. Not to mention if I'd been falsely kicked, I'd need time to cool off. But that's me.

Summary: No dodge timer. 5 minutes at most.


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Boss Aegis

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Senior Member

12-24-2012

Too bad every game has multiple trolls in them. If you had to get rid of all of them before you could try to play a game you would spend more time in queue than actually playing the game.


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Fongletto

Senior Member

12-24-2012

The Summoners Code, Section I, paragraph 2. You're welcome.

Being a good team player begins at champion select. Be open minded when considering the needs of your team. If you’re the last one to pick, try to fill a niche in your team that hasn’t already been filled. If everyone’s picked and something stands out as a deficiency in your team composition, try asking for another player to fill the gap, or change roles to embrace that responsibility yourself. Remember, that by taking on a role you don’t normally play, you’ll learn more about unfamiliar champions and increase your own skill level.

It says TRY. If you can't. Then you shouldn't. Sometimes it's better to have 2 adc's then a support who has literally no idea how to support.

There is no immediate punishment. And I noted the possibility of punishing those who falsely accuse. But again it takes 3 to kick. If 3 people agree you should be kicked, you don't want to play with them anyway.

I disagree, just because 3 people think you need to be kicked doesn't mean you need to be kicked. I also disagree that people delib trolling to get kicked is a much bigger problem then you think it would be.

I promise you're not so creative you're gonna come up with something no one has seen before. Leave that to SivHD. This whole playing outside the meta thing is the only real situation a see as being problematic, to your credit, you've found a hole. Albeit a small, nigh unnoticeable hole.

Actually its a huge hole. I and riot think so. Hence the reason they have not implemented this system. And the reason they have responded to 100 threads suggesting the same thing you have with that reasoning.

P.s. It doesn't matter if they have seen it before or not, if its outside the meta. Kicked and banned.

But again, you don't stray too far from the meta in ranked. The meta is the meta for a reason.

The meta is constantly changing and flowing thanks to those who move outside it. The game is ever changing. The meta doesn't change overnight. It's a slow gradual process by those who seek to always find a better way and changes in patches. Stifling this would be the first great step to making the game boring. Riot realizes this.


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Vanitius

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Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss Aegis View Post
Too bad every game has multiple trolls in them. If you had to get rid of all of them before you could try to play a game you would spend more time in queue than actually playing the game.
I don't think there are multiple trolls in every game. But if so: maybe at first. But I'd pretty much still be ok with that.


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Fongletto

Senior Member

12-24-2012

Alright I'm off. I'll just end on a note with. I can appreciate that you are trying to make the game more fun for everyone. I just think you need to evaluate your suggestion a little more. Try and come up with something that hasn't been suggested and shot down before 100 times. Something that adds more than it takes. Increased queue times and a few people banned from stepping outa the meta might not seem like a big deal to you. I think a large part of the population would disagree however.


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Mensen

Junior Member

12-24-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanitius View Post
tl&dr: I'm not offering a solution to trolling, I'm offering a solution to having to play with trolls.
But the vote-kick system is only a band-aid solution, and only complicates things.


Imagine you had a leak in your roof. Water is now dripping onto your floor. You can do two things:

1. Put a bucket/bowl underneath the drip, and contain the water

2. Fix your roof so it no longer leaks


The vote-kick solution is comparable to the first solution to the problem in the analogy. While is fixes the problem (water is no longer all over your floor), it introduces new problems (you now have a bowl/bucket in the middle of your hallway).

Likewise, the vote-kick solution simply introduces new problems.The fact of the matter is, vote-kick system has several negative consequences, including:

- Meta stagnation
- Period between successfully being matchmade and getting into a game is detrimentally increased
- And that "trolls" will still be there; they just won't have so much influence on what happens in champion select


Again, if this was the solution, it would of already happened. Believe it or not, Riot employees do play their own game, and experience everything you do. It is likely something of their concern and probably something they will address in the future.


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Tribunal Justice

Senior Member

12-24-2012

Your system is too easy to abuse. You assume that one side is right and one side is wrong. Often the problem is no one is right and someone has to go on and on about how they are right and the other guys is wrong.

That becomes really painful with the other guy feels the same way and goes on and on about it.

That's when you have a terrible game. And whose fault is it? Both.

That's why there's a system to judge and evaluate how people act. Even this system is having bugs in it from time to time as trends change and people become more or less punitive. However, it has more gradual steps that slowly identify people who are just bad to everyone basically.

What you want is immediate action to punish someone. It's a bad idea and would have bad results for a lot of people. People aren't meant to get along with all the other people in the world. But as long as you play the game and try to win that's what matters. Just ignore the other guy and do what you want to do because it's a game and not a matter of life or death. You can't control what someone else does so don't let them control you.


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Pawnbroker

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Junior Member

12-24-2012

I agree that there are legit reasons to dodge trolls etc... However, vote kick is not the answer. The number one reason I chose to focus my time learning LoL over other MOBAs is because this one doesn't vote kick players for their elo score alone.

If players can vote kick at champ select it will be abused to kick solo queue players who simply have a lower elo than others. This can result in 10 minutes added to the amount of time it takes to actually play a game.


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