Some simple Volibear playability thingies

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A bouncy Furret

Senior Member

12-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skoron View Post
The problem with his ultimate is that in order to get a good use out of it you have autoattack a lot, which can be a problem since every champion (at least those that are actually played) has some sort of escape and everyone runs flash. Unless you have Frozen Mallet, red buff, or your opponent is stupid enough to duel you when your ult's popped then you won't be able to get good use out of it. It doesn't really FEEL like an ultimate.

I'd support adding some kind of point-blank aoe slow to his ult and make his movespeed increased for the duration. You'd then be able to remove the slow from his E and buff it elsewhere. Honestly I'd like something that would help him in the jungle, possibly some sort of self-heal or a lifesteal buff like Lee and Olaf have on their W's.
Your first line made me think of something.

What if Voli's ult, when active, built charges similar to a Statikk Shiv that increased the damage of the next attack, making it less punishing for failing to attack


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eatworld

Junior Member

12-18-2012

I think his jungle is fine now as his e fear the mobs
If the fear goes to r then he would need something else to help him in the jungle.
How about making his r immune to slow?


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A bouncy Furret

Senior Member

12-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by eatworld View Post
I think his jungle is fine now as his e fear the mobs
If the fear goes to r then he would need something else to help him in the jungle.
How about making his r immune to slow?
His new E could either keep the fear, or give him some benefit to his jungle e.g. sustain or tankiness. Although the fear is a cool flavor mechanic and I'd like to see it stay.

Edit: Cement Volibear's role as a champion. Give his new E either, scaling damage (Bruiser) or no damage but reduces enemy damage dealt (Tank)


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Pteor

Member

12-18-2012

Personally, I feel like the current R is lack luster entirely. Its a mechanic that's on 2 different items in the exact same form, and Volibear's is on CD. Make that a passive effect like the one on Blitzcrank's R. Every nth attack on the same target causes chain-lightning, scaling say 5 at level one, 4/3/2 with ult rank. That gives him solo jungle clear speed at level one, but nothing to strong for pushing early.

Then make the R active be something beefy and tank-tastic. Maybe throw the E (fearing champions as well) onto the R, and cause it to give him bonus health Lulu ult style. Then turn the E into some kind of CC, because as a tank without hard CC, he won't fit the meta.

Feel like his Q is a problem too. Too easy to be kited and then he's useless. Give him a real gap closer, but keep the on next hit fling. Maybe use Vi's Q as a model, only without the speed decrease unless he isn't supposed to initiate. Something that can wall jump is always a good thing. Be kind of cool if he could dash through a thin wall, grab the carry and fling him back over the other side. Blitzcrank, but less safe.

Turns him into a run in, grab the carry, CC the carry, tank all teh damagez, die hero kind of champ.
His playstyle would remain semi-unique, since its based off of a fling and a dash. He can still deal decent damage in a team fight, and with a gap closed he has less trouble with ganks.

He also would join the ranks of tanks who scale incredibly well with AS items like Wit's End and Zephyr. (Shyvana, Cho'gath, Irelia as a bruiser).

EDIT: I feel like we need to move away from affects that are generated by items as his ultimate. He needs something unique to him, that makes him Volibear and not the bear with Statikk Shiv. Also feeling like tank is the way he needs to go. CC machines are getting rarer from the jungle, Cho and Mao and Alistar being the few off the top of my head. Need a champ with RAWR that can CC too.


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FineyLeee

Senior Member

12-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volty View Post
I've gone through a bit of this thread tonight. You guys, Ursa Arcadius and friends, are raising some great points. I'd like to improve Volibear. The front runner issue for me is to resolve how R's cast time feels bad, because standing still to cast is directly counter to the melee gameplan.

Two possibilities immediately present themselves:

1. Remove the cast time. (Boring but direct.)
2. Make the spell worthy of a cast time. This could be by adding another mechanic, like a material chunk of upfront PBAoE damage. Could even collapse the E into the R as a single (cast-time) spell and make a new E.

Thoughts?

Sorry I haven't had been responsive to this thread. Let's see what we can accomplish together!
WOHOO!!! Love you Volty! =D

Volibear was my favorite champion until he became outclassed by other champs. In my opinion, his passive and his W promotes building health, hence he is a great counter to true damage, which I think should be his thing.

Moving the E functionality to R instead definitely has its charm. However, there were some areas of use for the E that I feel Voli would lose if we do this:
1. When Q:ing towards an enemy champion, you often aren't fast enough to catch up to him within the Q time, therefore I use E to slow him when I get close to him to be able to make it. This is a very important QoL attribute that cannot be taken away.
2. When laning against someone that is able to harass you, you sometimes need E to finish off creeps from a short distance. Voli would be very crippled by not being able to do this.

Here's a completely different suggestion: Make it so that if you target an enemy champion with your R, you will jump onto him and deal some damage (not too long range). You will also apply a mark to him that makes it so all your R chain lightning strikes prioritizes this target if you aren't hitting directly on it.


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A bouncy Furret

Senior Member

12-18-2012

A mock up of what his new E could potentially look like (as a medium-long ranged skill shot).

Imperative Roar

Volibear shouts words of lightning, sending out a ball of delicious electrical pain (Think Dragonborn for the visuals). All units hit by this roar...

Option one-InitiatorBear: instantly lose 70% of their movement speed but quickly regain the lost speed over 1.5 second
Option two-BruisiBear: are slowed for up to 60% based on how low hp the target is and takes X(+Y bonus AP) magical damage
Option three-TankiBear: are frozen in place for 1 second and deal Z% reduced damage for T seconds

...any minions or monsters caught in this roar are feared for 3 seconds

I believe Voli should go the way of an AP bruiser instead of sometimes 60% physical 15% magical, sometimes 55% magical 30% physical etc depending on the build (notice how these hybrid builds don't add to 100%)

It's also a wonderful homage to this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5L3DMJB8yGM (and a wonderful skin idea)


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Volty

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Game Designer

12-18-2012
2 of 14 Riot Posts

A lot of good discussion already! But also a lot of varying points of view.

I agree that understanding our desires for role and lane will be helpful. If you reply I request that you state your preference for lane (e.g. top, jungle, lane support) and role (e.g. tank, fighter, melee dps).

I will consider and do more research tomorrow.


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MandyMemory

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Senior Member

12-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volty View Post
I've gone through a bit of this thread tonight. You guys, Ursa Arcadius and friends, are raising some great points. I'd like to improve Volibear. The front runner issue for me is to resolve how R's cast time feels bad, because standing still to cast is directly counter to the melee gameplan.

Two possibilities immediately present themselves:

1. Remove the cast time. (Boring but direct.)
2. Make the spell worthy of a cast time. This could be by adding another mechanic, like a material chunk of upfront PBAoE damage. Could even collapse the E into the R as a single (cast-time) spell and make a new E.

Thoughts?

Sorry I haven't had been responsive to this thread. Let's see what we can accomplish together!
I think a new E that's more toplane oriented instead of jungle would be better. His clear time is so bad, unless you wanted to fix that too.

I feel like Q should be the 1 point spell, so e should be something actually worth leveling.

edit: I just thought of a small aoe heal that also affects minions(Like alistar, but different somehow) That would help him both top and support (And may even help with jungling) Throw a fear-type thing on his ult, and the slow on his Q. I wouldn't want it just like rengar's, so the damage from e should probably be moved to other skills.

You could also play off of the armored part and give him an E that would greatly increase his tankyness. (Somehow different than just healing) That might let him go into either a pure tank role or allow him to build more damage instead.


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IS15780dc83872d25e80b86

Member

12-18-2012

The thing i dislike about voli is that his so called Ultimate Ability(100/90/80secs) has a longer cooldown then his passive(120secs).
Doesn't really feel ultimative when you have it less often at hand then your passive.


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Tybault Windsor

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Senior Member

12-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volty View Post
A lot of good discussion already! But also a lot of varying points of view.

I agree that understanding our desires for role and lane will be helpful. If you reply I request that you state your preference for lane (e.g. top, jungle, lane support) and role (e.g. tank, fighter, melee dps).

I will consider and do more research tomorrow.

I like my Volibear as a top laner best, and I like him as "the" tanky dps character, as he's the most literal example of one.

Builds complete tank and can still output massive damage, builds damage but is still incredibly resilient. Builds both and is an absolute monster. That kind of thing is what I'd personally like to see exemplified and focused on.

Edit: However, I don't want him to be like how Rengar was.

I'd love for something along the lines of Darius' damage dps curve where the longer Volibear is in the middle of a fight, the more damage he's dealing, so being resilient and staying in fights a long time is rewarded with Volibear achieving maximum dps.