Nami's Lore - Relationship with Diana

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KuzAnn

Senior Member

12-09-2012

Some things to add:

From Pantheon's bio, we see that the Rakkor have been known to fight with Demacia and Noxus on a regular basis, and both of these city-states have been around for hundreds of years. Noxus at the very least has been extremely aggressive toward pretty much everyone around them, so it's easy to think that they may have been fighting the Rakkor for well over 100 years. You'd think they would notice certain warriors that can call down the power of the sun or moon. Rakkor may be reclusive, but they're certainly not "unknown" to the other city-states, especially not Demacia and Noxus since they kept uselessly throwing battalions at them.

Heck, Leona's ascendance was seen throughout Demacia, at the Institute, and everywhere remotely near Mount Targon. If this sort of thing happened within the past 100, 200, or 300 years, people outside the Rakkor would write about it. This is a completely unique phenomenon we're talking about here, a complete mystery. The sun was shining at midnight. Here's the Journal of Justice Issue where it's talked about. They didn't say "Oh something like this happened over 100 years ago, we have records and theories about it," they have to go to Pantheon and ask him what's up. And Pantheon doesn't know either. He starts to bring up one possibility, but stops before he can give them anything of value. Probably because even Pantheon doubts that there could be another Sun avatar around. The Rakkor are supposed to consider the Sun avatars to be legend by now, according to Leona's lore. By lore we know that all Solari are Rakkor and from what Pantheon says in the article that they're a very important part of Rakkor society. The Lunari, Solari, and Rakkor are not separate tribes, just various groups in one tribe of people.

Weird sun phenomenon (and moon phenomenon since we're assuming that both the avatars were around a bit over 100 years ago now) should be something that astronomers and mages, if not pretty much everyone who can keep a journal, will write about when they notice them. Mages/summoners have been around for thousands of years. If they saw a strange event that they suspected to be magic----and let's face it, the sun shining at midnight or any time during the night is definitely magical in nature----they would write about it in detail and even theorize about it. Especially if they're constantly trying to outgun the magic on the other city-state's side.

As to the ages of Demacia and Noxus... There have been four generations of the Jarvans, and General Boram Darkwill used necromantic magic to outlive the first three only to be assassinated during the fourth. The two city-states existed before Boram and before the Jarvan line. Before Boram, Noxus was ruled by the Black Rose, and before the Jarvan line was established, the government of Demacia wasn't entirely stable. They would keep records. The League would have access to these records, yet they were completely shocked by sunlight shining on Mount Targon for ten minutes and had no explanation for it.

Now you might make the point that the Sun avatar is only a religious figure, they should have nothing to do with actual fighting, right? What's the point of the functional armor, then? The avatar doesn't get those abilities for nothing, they're meant to be used, and not just for burning heretics.

Ahh, rediscovering the JoJs and old League lore. I can't believe I overlooked the huge spectacle of Leona's ascension and the fact that Demacia and Noxus used to routinely lose battalions to the Rakkor. My mistake.


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Penkanuin

Junior Member

12-10-2012

I believe that Nami definitely shouldn't be a side story in the conflict versus the Lunari and the Solari, but I think that having a connection to Diana and the need for the Moonstone gives Diana and the Lunari credence. It should just be a strong point of added argument to Diana against the Solari who refuse to acknowledge her. It shows that there's a group of people, the Marai, that have historically had a strong relationship with the Lunari and have a role to play in Runeterra.


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GrimoireLaw

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Junior Member

12-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by KuzAnn View Post
Lots of cool stuff.
Interesting points you brought up here but while I don't have much to offer in terms of Nami's connection to Diana and the Mt. Targon crew storyline, I'd like to clarify 2 minor errors in your post.

1) Jarvan the III is still very much alive (Xin Zhao and J4's bio and judgment respectively show this, he's mentioned in JoJ issue 2, and the fact that J4 is still Prince, not King) and

2) It couldn't have been Leona's ascension seen by the Institute of War and everywhere else because Pantheon, the source they all turned to and gave that "Maybe...K bye", was present during Leona's ascension! Now, the LoL timeline may be a bit screwy and kind of all over the place, but the Rite of Kor is stated to have occurred when Leona and Pantheon were 16 and they're definitely (at least young) adults now. Also, when she refused to kill Molik, it was Pantheon, freshly bloodied from his own Kor, that their leader told to convince Leona to do it and he failed and then the Solari came, etc.

Chances are, that sunlight was her descending or using a Solar Flare to be a badass or something, given that the date of the JoJ article is also the date of her Judgement and induction into the League. Still, definitely right about how fun it is re-reading the JoJs!


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Dolphin PhD

Senior Member

12-11-2012

I bet GP has something to do with things as well. Guy likes to plunder.


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KuzAnn

Senior Member

12-11-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrimoireLaw View Post
Interesting points you brought up here but while I don't have much to offer in terms of Nami's connection to Diana and the Mt. Targon crew storyline, I'd like to clarify 2 minor errors in your post.

1) Jarvan the III is still very much alive (Xin Zhao and J4's bio and judgment respectively show this, he's mentioned in JoJ issue 2, and the fact that J4 is still Prince, not King) and

2) It couldn't have been Leona's ascension seen by the Institute of War and everywhere else because Pantheon, the source they all turned to and gave that "Maybe...K bye", was present during Leona's ascension! Now, the LoL timeline may be a bit screwy and kind of all over the place, but the Rite of Kor is stated to have occurred when Leona and Pantheon were 16 and they're definitely (at least young) adults now. Also, when she refused to kill Molik, it was Pantheon, freshly bloodied from his own Kor, that their leader told to convince Leona to do it and he failed and then the Solari came, etc.

Chances are, that sunlight was her descending or using a Solar Flare to be a badass or something, given that the date of the JoJ article is also the date of her Judgement and induction into the League. Still, definitely right about how fun it is re-reading the JoJs!
Yeah, I know J3 is still alive. I should've said that Boram's "seen" four generations of Jarvans, and Demacia and Noxus have been around(I'm guessing a long while) before either of them came to power.

Aw poop you're right. Sorry. Maybe Leona was doing the final ceremony for her training that night? What better time to show how much the sun watches over you than in the dead of night, right?


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Dumbhyun

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Junior Member

02-19-2013

It feels awkward bringing up an old topic..

But after reading all of these theories and conflicts about why the Rakkor would want anything to do with these Ocean dwellers who supposedly lived a large distance away...

I have a few things to note:

According to Fizz's lore, this water-dwelling civilization was located underneath a mountain (Mount Targon?). But it was hidden, which may account for its absence on Valaron's map. His lore also states that his civilization had its enemies but had an impenetrable defense (referring to Nami's lore and the moon stone?). However, it also states that upon returning from one of his adventures one day, Fizz finds his people have disappeared and his home has come to ruins. From this, we can assume that while Nami is out looking for a replacement battery (the moonstone) their defence system has already diminished and whatever enemies they had, took advantage of that.

Also, one thing I wanted to note about Diana was that her lore doesn't really mention her parents. I was thinking that maybe the Lunari haven't been wiped out entirely. That perhaps there are still descendants of the Lunari living among the Rakkor and even among the Solari people. So, those of you who say it's impossible for a race/religion of people to be eliminated within 100 years, this is my theory. I mean, with the Solari being like "Eliminate all Lunari!" it's obvious that there were those who rebelled (were probably slaughtered) and those who hid, converted, and blended in with the Solari. Among those people might have been Diana's parents, whether it be her father, mother, both, or even one of her grandparents. Diana is proof that the Lunari still exist.

Sorry for reviving a dead topic, lol, I just got around to reading Nami's lore and ended up developing my own opinion.


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Grand Viper

Senior Member

02-19-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by iMelonPan View Post
It feels awkward bringing up an old topic..

But after reading all of these theories and conflicts about why the Rakkor would want anything to do with these Ocean dwellers who supposedly lived a large distance away...

I have a few things to note:

According to Fizz's lore, this water-dwelling civilization was located underneath a mountain (Mount Targon?). But it was hidden, which may account for its absence on Valaron's map. His lore also states that his civilization had its enemies but had an impenetrable defense (referring to Nami's lore and the moon stone?). However, it also states that upon returning from one of his adventures one day, Fizz finds his people have disappeared and his home has come to ruins. From this, we can assume that while Nami is out looking for a replacement battery (the moonstone) their defence system has already diminished and whatever enemies they had, took advantage of that.

Also, one thing I wanted to note about Diana was that her lore doesn't really mention her parents. I was thinking that maybe the Lunari haven't been wiped out entirely. That perhaps there are still descendants of the Lunari living among the Rakkor and even among the Solari people. So, those of you who say it's impossible for a race/religion of people to be eliminated within 100 years, this is my theory. I mean, with the Solari being like "Eliminate all Lunari!" it's obvious that there were those who rebelled (were probably slaughtered) and those who hid, converted, and blended in with the Solari. Among those people might have been Diana's parents, whether it be her father, mother, both, or even one of her grandparents. Diana is proof that the Lunari still exist.

Sorry for reviving a dead topic, lol, I just got around to reading Nami's lore and ended up developing my own opinion.

I'm going to have to refute some of these points, using the lore. Fizz's mountain is an undersea mountain. This is a quote from his lore:

"Centuries ago, an ancient water-dwelling race built a hidden city beneath a mountain in the sea."

We know this better as a mid-ocean ridge, and this alone can bring in a lot of ideas as to what happened to Fizz's people. Unfortunately, Fizz and Nami are not related, and in all honesty? On this point, I wish they were. I wish such a comparison could be drawn, and that's why I think they could affect one another moreso than Diana and Nami can.

Diana's upbringing had nothing to do with her beliefs, it shaped her into the person she became.

Diana's lore:

"Though she was born to the Solari, Diana's inquisitive nature set her apart from her brethren. She had always found solace and guidance in the night sky, and questioned the dominance of the sun in her society. The Solari elders responded to her challenges with only derision and punishment. Diana remained convinced, however, that if she could find evidence of the moon's power, the elders would listen to reason."

The Moon is the reflection of the Sun at night. It's fairly easy for Diana to become more enamored with the Moon because of its nightly dominance and because of that d*mnable curiosity she had. Her parents were Solari, she was born and raised a Solari

I will say once more, what you said about Fizz and Nami having any association, is nonexistent, but that is what I wish Riot would do. Nami's lore needs very minor tweaks, and the direction and the champions she can be enlisted to help.


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isabella valenti

Member

04-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoresuMakashi View Post
The mention of the moonstone initially piqued my interest for possible links to Diana.

The following quotes from IronStylus have cemented this link:


My theory:
The "Lunari" was the civilisation that customarily traded the moonstone for the pearl with Nami's people. Sometime in the last 100 years, the Solari wiped out the "Lunari" (a theory that already has quite strong evidence of its own), attempting to erase all knowledge of its teachings and existence, thus explaining why the moonstone carrier never showed up for Nami. Additional evidence is provided by "a powerful object found only in the towering reaches of the surface world", suggesting that the moonstone is to be found on Mount Targon. Now it falls to Nami to discover the truth before the current moonstone that protects her village fails.
what if diana is namis last hope for the survival of her village and riot has some weird easter egg like the kha zix and rengar one! o.O


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OriginalA

Senior Member

04-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by isabella valenti View Post
what if diana is namis last hope for the survival of her village and riot has some weird easter egg like the kha zix and rengar one! o.O
Oh!
Unique quest if Nami and Diana are on a team vs a Leona.
If Leona kills Diana she gets a buff for bringing justice down on the heretic.
If Diana kills Leona she gets a buff for not letting the Solari suppress the truth.
If Nami kills Leona and keeps Diana alive, she gets a buff for finding the moonstone or something like that.
hmmm. No, that wouldn't do in that exact form, but I like the concept.


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Kopikatsu

Senior Member

04-20-2013

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grand Viper View Post
I'm sorry, but 100 years to completely take out a major religion and destroy all of its followers and essentially wipe out every trace they have save for very very scant and shaky signs? Diana had to delve into ancient texts and not semi-old texts. It doesn't make sense. From a historical perspective, it doesn't make sense.

Now that I think about it a bit more, the ceremony has to take place every 100 years. That means the complete and utter eradication of the Lunari in fact took place in less than 100 years. It just...doesn't make a lot of sense and makes it more unrealistic.

Edit: Snippet of Diana's lore:

"This clue led her to a secluded valley on Mount Targon where she unearthed the hidden entrance to an ancient, sealed temple. Inside, among aging relics and faded murals..."

What is the definition of ancient?

Ancient
1. Of great age; very old.
2. Of or relating to times long past, especially those of the historical period before the fall of the Western Roman Empire (a.d. 476).

Is the Eiffel Tower an ancient structure? It was completed in 1889, and is more than a hundred years now. Ancient is a long, long time. I know we're not dealing with the Roman Empire, but the basic definition for Ancient is more than 1500 years ago minimum (Doing an approximate amount of years). 100 years is not ancient, it truly isn't.
Iunno. Could be a Star Wars thing; like how people treated the Jedi like they were an ancient myth when they actually had a significant standing in the universe like twenty years prior to Part IV. Guess everyone has short term memory loss or something.