@Ironstylus: has anyone ever rejected your concept art ideas and told you to redo em?

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Drozzi

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
-snip-
Thanks for taking the time to reply, really gave us a lot of insight on the process of conceptualizing and creating a champion.
And I agree, the original diana art was really good, but she just looked more like side character than a main character like the current iteration of her.
Glad she turned out the way she did.

&really curious about that original graves concept, no chance of a peek at it is there?


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IronStylus

Sr. Concept Artist

11-18-2012
6 of 12 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by blitz4 View Post
Woot, thanks IronStylus, first time quoted by a red. =D

Anyways while I got you...Just curious, do you know the spells/abilities before you design a champion?

(Just trying to get an idea of just how restricted the conditions you are working under are so I can gain an even further appreciation for the work you do)
We're never restricted, at all. We only have guidelines if there happens to be a particular note we're trying to hit, or an archetype we're trying to nail. Draven, we knew he was going to do crazy stuff with axes, but no one had any idea how crazy and over the top he'd be. That personality was injected as the character evolved.

There may be story points we're trying to his, abilities we're trying to illustrate, or themes we're trying to emphasize, but we're not restricted in any significant way.

There's a particular character I'm helping with that indeed pretty much has most of the abilities spelled out, there's a prototype, but it could certainly change. Other champions I've worked on, like Diana, most of those spells and abilities were constructed long after her art had an established direction. In that way each discipline adapts to the other. Volty knew he had to do work with the moon motif and a giant sword. He made do =)


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IronStylus

Sr. Concept Artist

11-18-2012
7 of 12 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Diana's one of the best examples of this, agreed The initial idea had a lot of merit, but it lacked something special or iconic at first - "moon knight that is anti-Leona" is one good component, but the heritic and detachment angles added a ton of personality and archetype-recognition to the character that made it come to life. The concept art was then updated to incorporate the new elements - essentially, the character evolved.

This happens on everything! From concept art, to kit prototypes, to bios, ideas aren't sacred, and nothing is ever good on the first shot.
Diana was an excellent learning experience and I think helped teach us all how collaboration helps so very much in finding the "secret sauce" =)


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Daemon

Senior Member

11-18-2012

I really want to see some scrapped ideas and skins. Like the original Graves concept (although I suppose that original concept could be rehashed into a new Ezreal-like guy)!

What constitutes a "good idea"? I mean, how do you know if the community is going to like it? I'm sure you have people who research that stuff, but some champions that make it through are not popular designs (e.g. people mostly love Karma's design, but mostly hate Syndra's design. Both are pretty subpar at their respective roles, so popularity isn't a factor here.).

Also, random question, is Karma getting a model remake? Please tell me she keeps her awesomely impractical dress.


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Calderweiss

Senior Member

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Primanocte

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Can we get an apology for DV Diana? Or at least a real explanation.


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Chronololololol

Junior Member

11-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
Yeah, the original concept of Diana was neat, but was it anything special? Would that design stand the test of time? Does it tell a story? I don't think so. I learned a lot during that process, especially since that even if it's a cool piece of art, it doesn't mean that will make up for lack of story.

I think Diana tells a story in her final concept. I think the original was just that, 'good', not great, and definitely not as memorable as she came out in the end.
If you're still here, is there any chance of a Diana skin with a resemblance to that orginal concept art? or do you think it's be too similar to her classic skin. Because as much as like her current design, I really love that original one.


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Anialator100

Senior Member

11-18-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronStylus View Post
We're never restricted, at all. We only have guidelines if there happens to be a particular note we're trying to hit, or an archetype we're trying to nail. Draven, we knew he was going to do crazy stuff with axes, but no one had any idea how crazy and over the top he'd be. That personality was injected as the character evolved.

There may be story points we're trying to his, abilities we're trying to illustrate, or themes we're trying to emphasize, but we're not restricted in any significant way.

There's a particular character I'm helping with that indeed pretty much has most of the abilities spelled out, there's a prototype, but it could certainly change. Other champions I've worked on, like Diana, most of those spells and abilities were constructed long after her art had an established direction. In that way each discipline adapts to the other. Volty knew he had to do work with the moon motif and a giant sword. He made do =)
that third paragraph hints at a future champion. is there anything you can tell us about this one. is it from the void, a monster, a human or other humanoid race. what element is thier focus on (is it a swordsman, someone who controls the earth, ect.). or is it just going to be a big mystery.


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Jamadman

Senior Member

11-18-2012

I finally find some one who has seen outlaw star, its Ironstylus.

so happy right now.


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IronStylus

Sr. Concept Artist

11-18-2012
8 of 12 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daemon View Post
I really want to see some scrapped ideas and skins. Like the original Graves concept (although I suppose that original concept could be rehashed into a new Ezreal-like guy)!

What constitutes a "good idea"? I mean, how do you know if the community is going to like it? I'm sure you have people who research that stuff, but some champions that make it through are not popular designs (e.g. people mostly love Karma's design, but mostly hate Syndra's design. Both are pretty subpar at their respective roles, so popularity isn't a factor here.).

Also, random question, is Karma getting a model remake? Please tell me she keeps her awesomely impractical dress.
I'll see what I can throw up, be warned, it's really really bad =/

I'm not sure what constitues a good idea. It's not really an equation. It's more of a feeling when all the pieces put together. We sort of measure it simply in fun and if the champion feels like a character that tells a story, that stands out from other characters in similar media.

Specifically in how I work, how I judge whether the community or the player is going to like it is by doing a lot of what I do now, solicit feedback and learn from the input I recieve. I judge my work mainly by, in the words of Morello, does it sell the fantasy? Again, in the case of Diana, we're trying to sell emotionally detached killer heretic who is imbued with the celestial might of the moon. I think in the visuals we communicated that in the sharp crescents designed into her. We made her gameplay feel self-immolating and vicious, we made her story one of tragedy. I think so long as we hit on those points and reflected the fantasy in all three areas, we're going to hit the right note.

In terms of Syndra, I think that's more of an opportunity thing, something again, that we've learned from. We made a cool evil floating lady with a head dress and giant black... spheres. It ended up as more of a costume change in it's overall design rather than an extremely unique character. Sometimes that happens. I think all we do is learn from that and make sure we take bigger leaps in experimentation rather than playing it conservative with "hot chick in tight costume" thing.

Karma will get a visual rework, but it's going to be a but different. I can't elaborate on that but it will be something I think will be very welcome. I've worked on her visual rework in a bunch of capacities.


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