@ RiotNome Blackfire Torch

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EdgarAlanPWN88

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Senior Member

11-13-2012

RiotNome, I had a question about Blackfire Torch and Teemo.

What is the code reason why Teemo's Toxic Shot does NOT apply the Blackfire Torch proc on enemy champions? It is a Single Target, Magic Damage, Passive, DoT, Debuff.

Is the fact that Toxic Shot is a passive and not an Active spell cast the reason why? (though I did just see a bug posted about Toxic Shot having a cooldown)

Ignore the fact that it would potentially OP, I am asking WHY this happens. Unless you disabled it because it would be OP.

Thanks!

P.S. Really enjoy the work you have done, and are continuing to do. You are awesome for giving so much feedback so quickly.


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JustMyBassCannon

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Senior Member

11-13-2012

Blackfire Torch only applies to activated spells. It's a SPELL on-hit effect, not an ATTACK on-hit effect.

Blade of the Ruined King should be fine for on-hit Teemo.


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EdgarAlanPWN88

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Senior Member

11-13-2012

So, went and tested. Cho Gath's Vorpal Spikes will trigger Blackfire Torch, but Twitch's Deadly Venom does not. Deadly Venom is an On Hit Effect. Is Vorpal Spikes is an autoattack proc'ed AoE spell?

I am now curious as to why the Vorpal Spikes will proc Blackfire Torch, but Toxic Shot doesnt.


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ProfDrDeath

Senior Member

11-14-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by EdgarAlanPWN88 View Post
So, went and tested. Cho Gath's Vorpal Spikes will trigger Blackfire Torch, but Twitch's Deadly Venom does not. Deadly Venom is an On Hit Effect. Is Vorpal Spikes is an autoattack proc'ed AoE spell?
This should be the reason for its behaviour. Similarily, VS procs Spellvamp and Rylais in the AoE way, while DV/TS do not.


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SerratedBlaze

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Senior Member

11-14-2012

It sounds like dot applications without initial damage do not trigger it. If spikes are considered one time spell damage and teemo/twitch poisons are dot spell damage then that would explain it


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Peligrad

Senior Member

11-14-2012

I think its a matter of damage application. Vorpal spikes have an AoE similar to a spell while auto attacks apply the others.

It sounds like debuffs don't proc it because they are counted as their own entities.

It makes sense...you wouldn't want debuffs proc'ing debuffs.

I could see some really terrible windfury effects going on if they did...


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BlazzedTroll

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Senior Member

11-14-2012

Was just coming here to make a post about this.. I think teemo is a very strong AP character that benefits greatly from Blackfire Torch and it's recent change to buff move speed however, his Q and R are the only spells that can proc the effect. This makes the passive mostly useless. I obviously cast dart on people but then I can't get another proc on the affect for quite sometime and then I am just banking on people to hit my shrooms (which they do but still). I think the burn should apply and stack with his E.


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Khalahn

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11-14-2012

Rule of thumb: If you don't have to press a button for an ability to work, it does not apply spell vamp/Rylai's/Blackfire.


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SheriffV2

Senior Member

11-14-2012

Same reason it doesn't proc Rylais. There is a Riot post about that somewhere.

But the basic gist is: It is a free ability, and they don't want to give it something that was designed for cost abilities.


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EdgarAlanPWN88

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11-14-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalahn View Post
Rule of thumb: If you don't have to press a button for an ability to work, it does not apply spell vamp/Rylai's/Blackfire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SheriffV2 View Post
Same reason it doesn't proc Rylais. There is a Riot post about that somewhere.

But the basic gist is: It is a free ability, and they don't want to give it something that was designed for cost abilities.
Ok, but neither of these makes any sense when Toxic Shot is compared to Vorpal Spikes.

Vorpal Spikes USED to be the EXACT same as Toxic Shot. Vorpal Spikes was changed to a toggle because Cho would get aggro under a tower when attacking the tower. Now you have to press a button, but the effect is the same, Magic Damage effect upon an AutoAttack. Teemo is a Single Target Debuff, while Cho is a AoE Instant Damage.

Vorpal Spikes is a free ability, no cost, only a cooldown so players cant accidentally toggle it too quickly.

If this is the reason, how about letting Teemo TOGGLE Toxic Shot? This would work perfectly with Blackfire Torch, save up stacks by only using basic attacks, then toggle Toxic Shot to use Blackfire Torch procs when you want to really damage the enemy.


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