Riot: Questions About Duo Queue ("Solo Queue")

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hyliandanny

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Senior Member

09-21-2010

Some things were explained in the thread about matchmaking, but here are some questions that some of us are still bouncin' around in our heads.

1. Why did the design honchos decide to allow duo queues in what would be named the "Solo Queue"?
2. You guys have researched and mathematically quantified the advantage of being a pre-made. You make changes and take precautions for balancing the teams as much as possible. Does the need for such studies and precautions not indicate that duo players have an impact on games that perhaps affects solo players too much? Why is this impact considered acceptable?

For players that are wondering about that research....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zileas View Post
  • If you are in a pre-made team, your rating is the average of you and your team members, along with an increase based on the type of pre-made you are to make sure that you get tougher opponents, because being a pre-made is an advantage. This bonus is calculated from a bunch of research we did on hundreds of thousands of game results to figure out how much of an advantage being in a team is. We do some behind the scenes adjustments as well for stuff like beginners paired with pros, etc.
3. Can we expect an actual solo queue in the future? Given that -- when polls like this one, or this one, are actually visible to players -- the community has indicated there is definite room for improvement for solo players, it would be much appreciated.

Thanks, Riot. Your input on the matter is much appreciated for this Season One surprise that has mystified many since its introduction to the live servers.

-Danny
ardent believer that DotA's solo experience was well within Riot's power

TL;DR: Riot, why have you forsaken [solo players]?


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DOTAmakesMeLOL

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09-21-2010

too long, just read enough to verfy your point of view then +1'd xD


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Insanious

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09-21-2010

I believe the difference between solo or 2-man is only really visible in LOW Elo, where 2 players can win vs 5 players.

Once you get into a respectable Elo, the boost that a 2 man gets over solo-queuers is VERY small.

This is why 2 man teams have small Elo boosts in Normal play, where as 3 man has a noticeable jump, as does 4 man, and especially 5 man.


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Panzerfauste

Senior Member

09-21-2010

Dont get pissed I have friends and you dont.


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hyliandanny

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09-21-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Insanious View Post
I believe the difference between solo or 2-man is only really visible in LOW Elo, where 2 players can win vs 5 players.

Once you get into a respectable Elo, the boost that a 2 man gets over solo-queuers is VERY small.

This is why 2 man teams have small Elo boosts in Normal play, where as 3 man has a noticeable jump, as does 4 man, and especially 5 man.
That's understandable: where teamwork is more natural, teams are not necessary. Are you saying that duo queue is allowed as a way to get out of that team-less environment and, essentially, into a more solo-appropriate one after compensating for those deficiencies?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panzerfauste View Post
Dont get pissed I have friends and you dont.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xh_9QhRzJEs

-Danny
just me onry


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Insanious

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09-21-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by hyliandanny View Post
That's understandable: where teamwork is more natural, teams are not necessary. Are you saying that duo queue is allowed as a way to get out of that team-less environment and, essentially, into a more solo-appropriate one after compensating for those deficiencies?
Basically I'm saying that in a Low Elo environment, a single player can carry. Two players can easily carry them selves if they are vastly Superior to those they are playing (say two 1800 Elo players just starting into 1200 Elo... a 600 Elo gap, ya)

This allows players who are very good to leave lower Elo and start getting to their correct Elo faster.

If you are a 1200 Elo player, queueing with another 1200 Elo player will not give a significant advantage to your playing and you will not be able to gain Elo above your actual rating by doing so. (A single team of two does not make a team, unless they are vastly Superior to every other player in the game).

Now once you get closer to your correct Elo (say the two 1800 Elo players get to 1600 Elo). Their teamwork will not be enough to carry them any higher, and their enhanced communication will be worth A LOT less as they will need to communicate with the other 3 players on their team if they wish to win.

The bonus they gain is very small now, almost negligible and they will have to simply rely on being A team of (1800, 1800, 1600, 1600, 1600) vs (1600, 1600, 1600, 1600, 1600) Elo to be able to continue to carry them due to them having a combined 400 Elo higher than the other team. This will simply be the gain of having good players in Solo Queue rather than duo Queueing actually doing anything.

Now, once the players hit their correct Elo (so everyone is 1800 Elo) their enhanced communication means very little, as without communication with the rest of the team they will not advance (similar to the two 1200 Elo players duo Queueing together in a 1200 Elo environment.)

Simply their skills vs the other team will matter and being in a team of two means very little as they can no longer carry like they could vs 1200 Elo players.