@Riot A serious discussion about gender. Please read

First Riot Post
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Vanra

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Personally I would like to see more female monsters. Would it have killed Riot to give Kha'Zix a female voice? Not like they'd have to change the skin or anything.


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GaafGrohiik

Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by LandoCaldippian View Post
Lee Sin is shirtless, yes, but nothing about his pose is inherently sexy. He's doing a martial arts stance and his face says he's about ready to put his foot up somebody's ass.

Fiora is twisting around so you can get a good view of her "assets" and giving you the **** me eyes while doing it. You can see a similar pose on a real woman in an obviously sexual picture below for comparison. The fact of the matter is if you try to make that pose in real life you have to bend your back at an extreme angle, and there's no practical reason to do it beyond sexual appeal. It's certainly not a fighting stance.

While Lee might not be able to fight the way he's standing, it's a pose that shows his strength and dexterity. Fiora's only shows how far she can stick her ass out and spread her legs while still standing up.
That's a side-face stance, pretty much standard for epee fencing. And her twisting that way is to show off the dagger she has strapped to her back.


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Daemon

Senior Member

10-07-2012

This entire thread in a nutshell is:

-More diverse women. The men are diverse in size (Garen and Trynd at one end of an extreme, Ezreal at the other end.), but the only diversity in female shape is either yordle or human. Anivia and Cass are two differences, but Cass' upper half is the cookie cutter female shape.

-Practical clothing for women. Why does Syndra look like she walked out of a BSDM store while another male mage such as Swain wears a full robe? Why does Akali wear barely nothing when Shen and Kennen are fully clothed? Why does Sejuani wear a fur bikini in a climate like northern Russia? Also, everyone hates battle heels.

-Readability as an excuse to give all females giant boobs or Barbie waists is about as logical as telling a real woman that you cannot tell if she is female or male because her boobs aren't big enough or she's too fat. (expect a slap in the face if you ever tell a woman that)


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EbonRat

Recruiter

10-07-2012

I don't think that Riot makes horridly out of proportion champions. Look at some of the other f2p games out there, then come back. Miss Fortune just got the supermodel look, and Ahri always has, but other than that (in my opinion) no one screams out of proportion.


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Emailsúpport

Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by callmejenkins View Post
>_> attractive things to men -> large boobs, thin waist, general stuff like that. But you can't compare it to women because they don't value the same things. I'm 100000000% sure women are more concerned about your personality. Sadly, showing that in a picture is difficult and is done through the lore and through the champions voice, where as showing an attractive girl is much, much, much more easily done in a picture.
Fun fact: men care just as much about personalities as a woman do, men cares just as much about boobs as women care about peníses.

Yeah it's harder to appeal to female players because some of you like real men, some of you like Justin Bieber like males (see: Varus, Ezreal) and some of you like bodybuilder.
Men like women who are not fat.


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get dat birdman

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rauhel View Post
I'm sorry. I tried to be as objective as I could, and I know I failed in some areas. Pentakill Olaf was brought to my attention by my friend. She said she KNEW he was going to be used as a counterargument anytime a player beings up gender representation just like Tryndamere. And she's right. That night I logged in to see joke threads about Olaf making people feel bad about their bodies. The thing is, Olaf is not presented in a sexual fashion, and I will stand by my guns that he is not conventionally attractive. Gragas is morbidly obese, and there are fringe groups that are into that, but that doesn't mean I can honestly list him as a sexualized male champion.
I agree with Gragas being a very off-the-wall example (but hey, different strokes for different folks). The thing is, Ryze is an even better counterpoint than Pentakill Olaf purely due to the impracticality of his garments (or lack thereof). My issue is that you take generalization to the extreme, and speak for your entire demographic when it's unjust to do so.

Quote:
Olaf and Tryndamere are also not conventionally attractive. Male beauty is not as defined as female beauty, and people's tastes tend to vary much more when it comes to me, but bodybuilders are usually never even brought up when people try to define the standard of male beauty. Personally, if you can have a career as a professional model, then we can talk about whether or not you are sexualized. Male models have a huge range of body types, but I have never seen a bodybuilder. That tells me that bodybuilding is just not sexy to a majority of people.
/shrug Gragas is attractive to some people. And while "beauty" is differing for different people, you have to understand that not everyone finds people like Varus attractive. I've known people to say that even he would have a "body builder" body type, purely because he's not thin as a rail. Also, I would point out fitness models are larger than your average male runway model, and generally have overall more musculature, whereas a normal male model you'd typically see is usually thinner, generally a slighter build than your average joe on the street. Male models actually have to adhere to the same prescripts that female models do - tall, and skinny.

Quote:
In either case. Neither Tryndamere nor Pentakill Olaf present themselves as a sexual conquest. Can people find them attractive? Sure! But do they look like they care? Not at all. Meanwhile, a vast majority of female champions seem to go out of their way to make sure people think they are sexy. It's all about presentation. Does that make sense?
I would argue that old Soraka doesn't care. I'd probably also say that Battle Bunny Riven with Giant Sword to Stab People With doesn't really care if people sexualize her. If all you look at is their pose and body type, you're analyzing the art completely wrong. Did you take time to look at their facial expressions, too? The weapons they are wielding, and how they are wielding them? "Presenting oneself" as a sexual conquest is actually pretty hard to do when they've got a huge ass weapon in your face. I would agree that Fiora and Sona manage to do so, however (Sona with her smirk - though this could be a Mona Lisa effect, Fiora with her pose, and generally hiding her weapon). I just think you could take the time to look at the WHOLE package and not just one or two things that suit your argument - hence I bring up the other Riven and Vayne skins earlier. Looking at JUST one skin from either champion is not looking at the WHOLE CHAMPION.


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Xarkanadushak

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

while sona is a music champion we don't have a sonic based champion really so with discussions of having a "big woman" archetype why the hell don't we have an opera singer yet


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Emailsúpport

Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanra View Post
Personally I would like to see more female monsters. Would it have killed Riot to give Kha'Zix a female voice? Not like they'd have to change the skin or anything.
I agree with you completely... A female Cho'Gath like creature would be really cool. We have Anivia but she's not really a monster.

But humans are FINE.


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Dr Sloth MD

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Senior Member

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by EbonRat View Post
I don't think that Riot makes horridly out of proportion champions. Look at some of the other f2p games out there, then come back. Miss Fortune just got the supermodel look, and Ahri always has, but other than that (in my opinion) no one screams out of proportion.
Dude if most women looked like the female champs in LoL I would cry tears of joy. Huge ****, tight curves, and Sir-Mix-A-Lot booties simply aren't that common. The reason you see that in other games is... wait for it... *** APPEAL TO MALE GAMERS!

Holy **** guys, this really isn't that hard. I like to see total babes as much as the next guy, but I feel like I'm playing a game for horny teenagers when nearly every female character is at least an 8/10 stunner.


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Ginga

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Recruiter

10-07-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emailsúpport View Post
Fun fact: men care just as much about personalities as a woman do, men cares just as much about boobs as women care about peníses.

Yeah it's harder to appeal to female players because some of you like real men, some of you like Justin Bieber like males (see: Varus, Ezreal) and some of you like bodybuilder.
Men like women who are not fat.
Whoa there. Muscles are pretty close to what women see in men as men see boobs in women.........assuming I worded that right. :/


That's the problem with the OP. He doesn't consider a lot of sexualized males as sexualized just because they're not sexualized to him. Look at covers of all those "bodice-ripper" erotic novels middle-aged women loves reading so much. They often show Conan-like men. And trust me....while personality is important in everybody, chances are, if a woman is hot enough, personality can be thrown right out the window for most men nowadays. Some might be turned off by incredibly shallow "Legally-Blonde" type characters, but in general, an attractive figure holds a lot of weight for a lot of men in this day and age.



Also, if Justin Bieber looked like Varus, he'd be the next Marilyn Manson...parents would be burning effigies of him for "trying to corrupt their kids" and "trying to convert people to satanism"