Riot will NEVER respond to any thread of importance (and here's why)

First Riot Post
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Tryndamere

President / Co-Founder

Follow MarcMerrill on Twitter

08-06-2012
1 of 92 Riot Posts

Thanks for the detailed initial post. I understand and can relate to your frustration, because for years, I sat on your guys side of the fence as a passionate gamer who really wanted to help the game that I loved be even better. I would sit for hours writing up detailed posts, I would discuss with my friends and I would wrack my brain on figuring out how to "get through" to the company that could make decisions that impacted this thing that I cared about so greatly.

It is thus a strange twist of fate that I now sit where I sit and have the ability to either cause great frustration in you all, or, to alleviate this frustration and ideally channel your passionate energy into something constructive for our game and community.

Let me attempt to do so (in a small way) by responding to this post, but hopefully by the end of reading this, I will help reassure some of you that each and every day, 24 hours a day, these are precisely the things that we spend all of our time thinking about - because we want the same things you do.

Quote:
Okay, before reading, please know that I am not mad about any of these situations. Many of the comments have made it seem like I am butthurt about not getting my 1kRP, and I'm not. I'm simply fed up with how they've HANDLED these situations.
Still, Riot is a fantastic company, and they're superior in player support to almost all other gaming companies. This thread is to prevent Riot from becoming another Blizzard or EA. I SIMPLY WANT THEM TO HOLD THEMSELVES ACCOUNTABLE
Agreed. Allow me to apologize officially on behalf of Riot for our poor handling of many situations. If it is any consolation, I would like you (and whomever else reads this), that we do very thorough and formalized "retrospectives" of all of these events - and many others - to help us do better in the future and not make the same mistakes, or, to react to current situations that we haven't adequately addressed. Many of the topics you have listed are situations that various teams at the company are actively working on.

Now, what does "actively working on" mean? This is one thing that you cite that is frustrating. Sure we "say" that we are "actively working on" something, but words are wind - as we all know.

That's one of the reason we created the League of Legends timeline, http://timeline.leagueoflegends.com/ - we wanted to remind everyone about how significantly the game has evolved and will continue to evolve because we are constantly "actively working" on many things.

But the underlying reason for a lot of the issues you have cited with concern is that Riot has grown a lot in order to expand our capabilities to support tens of millions of users around the world, and ensuring that all of the multitude of things that we do on a daily basis are always awesome and fully aligned with our goal of delighting you all with awesome, is simply put, difficult. The good news is that we are a company that learns very quickly and has amazing people at all levels of the company who care deeply about this mission. We WANT to deliver awesome with everything that we do. When we don't, we take it very seriously.

I can say with confidence, that this is one thing that separates us from many other companies - from top to bottom, the thing that matters most to us is delighting our players and that's what drives our decisions. When we do something that deviates from that, it is likely due to sub-optimal execution, or misalignment internally, rather than any deliberate attempt to be not awesome. It's hard to demonstrate this, but I think the players who have come to events and met us or visited the office can vouch for these things, but ideally we'll have more ways to communicate and reinforce these ideals in a more scaleable way in the future (we are actively working on that =p).

Quote:
Sure, Riot occasionally responds to threads like these, but they never say something substantial. They just talk about how "they care about the community," how they "try their best to make the community happy," and other ways of beating around the bush. They haven't addressed anything like this head on.
The real reason we don't address some of these things head on, is because often times we don't have great answers and/or are working on great long term solutions that aren't ready for daylight yet.

We have learned over time (from community feedback) that saying we are working on something really isn't a great answer, because time is a very important factor that has a different perception depending on who is looking at the situation and whose perspective we are looking at it from. Example: if a character is slightly OP, say has a 2% higher win rate than our average, (by tending to win too many matchups, or be too versatile, etc), the severity of the issue can be different depending on who is looking at the situation. Competitive players may think it is a major issue due it this character impacting the meta (picks, bans, lane allocations, etc), while many other players may not care at all. Or, our design team may think that a noob stompy champion (say, Tryndamere!!1) who is not frequently used at high level play, is a much more important issue to address because it impacts a large % of players, but the competitive tier doesn't really have this come up on their radar, etc.

The key is that things are relative based on the viewers perspective (any physics or philosophy majors out there?).

Now, that's a design example, but we may have a similar situation re: priorities that hit other issues, like pricing, development priorities, etc. Sometimes we "stop gap" until we have a better long term solution.

A great example is pricing. We haven't been fully happy with our pricing communication, approach and execution because believe it or not, pricing is not something that receives much attention from most senior people at the company. We're focused on creating awesome - like developing E-sports, building game features, improving our content or intellectual property, building the organization, launching internationally, etc.

Pricing, aside from us saying "let's have the game be free forever and never sell power" has largely been an after thought because our view is that if we create awesome, then our players will reward us. That has held true.

Thus, if we botch the retirement of skins, or don't have enough sales, it is really due to organizational momentum and the lack of real leadership driving a directional change based on your guys feedback. The good news is, for those who care about pricing and those types of things, is that we have real, dedicated leadership here now who can focus on doing a better job of ensuring your needs are better met from that perspective.

Now, that doesn't mean that all skins will now cost 0 IP, or something equally drastic, but what it DOES mean is that there will be a lot more careful consideration, focus and communication with you all about what we're doing there.

With pretty much anything that sucks that we do, the upstream "cause" can be traced to that - the lack of sufficient mindshare because we probably think something else is more important - until we find the right person or grow the organization in such a way as to enable us to do all that we need to do in parallel.

There's no conspiracy where we're sitting around twisting our mustaches, if anything, the only mustache twisting we do is in regards to "creating more awesome" and figuring out how to delight you. Ask any Rioter, and they will tell you the same thing. Pretty much all of our focus internally is on that.

Quote:
Riot's strategy is Ignore, Deny, Forget. If they leave the community hanging for long enough, we'll forget, and we won't care. Well guess what, Riot. I haven't forgotten, and I do care. I love you guys, Riot, and I want to see you succeed. However, when you show blatant disregard for the community, that's when I get mad. Please, Riot, we'd rather have you acknowledge your mistakes than ignore them.
That's really just not the case. The problem simply relates to more "noise" and more things to do. We now are the largest online game in the world and serve (literally) tens of millions of gamers. Scale is hard, but we think we're up to the challenge and we appreciate your support.

You holding faith that we WILL do better is important to us, and don't be afraid to call us out when we're not as awesome as we usually are - because it is critical for us to keep our execution bar as high (or even higher) than it has always been.

The cool thing is, in all seriousness, we do have tons of awesome in store and our capabilities are stronger than ever. The Season 3 teaser from today is a sneak peak in this direction, but we have a lot more awesome coming that I don't want to spoil with a message board post (because the announcements or the releases will be 100000000x cooler).

Hopefully this was helpful and thanks for all of your patience while we keep trying to do an even better job for you guys.

On a personal note, my ELO has dropped from about 1650 to 1400 because I'm focusing so much more on trying to build our organizational capabilities than I am at keeping my LOL skills sharp - another tragedy that I look forward to remedying (so trust me when I say I'm motivated)!


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Fortus

Senior Member

08-06-2012

posting after trynd!


@topic;

well, not only did a red respond, the MOST important red did, so OP, you are busted.

/next myth.


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EndlessCycle

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryndamere View Post
Thanks for the detailed initial post. I understand and can relate to your frustration, because for years, I sat on your guys side of the fence as a passionate gamer who really wanted to help the game that I loved be even better. I would sit for hours writing up detailed posts, I would discuss with my friends and I would wrack my brain on figuring out how to "get through" to the company that could make decisions that impacted this thing that I cared about so greatly.

It is thus a strange twist of fate that I now sit where I sit and have the ability to either cause great frustration in you all, or, to alleviate this frustration and ideally channel your passionate energy into something constructive for our game and community.

Let me attempt to do so (in a small way) by responding to this post, but hopefully by the end of reading this, I will help reassure some of you that each and every day, 24 hours a day, these are precisely the things that we spend all of our time thinking about - because we want the same things you do.



Agreed. Allow me to apologize officially on behalf of Riot for our poor handling of many situations. If it is any consolation, I would like you (and whomever else reads this), that we do very thorough and formalized "retrospectives" of all of these events - and many others - to help us do better in the future and not make the same mistakes, or, to react to current situations that we haven't adequately addressed. Many of the topics you have listed are situations that various teams at the company are actively working on.

Now, what does "actively working on" mean? This is one thing that you cite that is frustrating. Sure we "say" that we are "actively working on" something, but words are wind - as we all know.

That's one of the reason we created the League of Legends timeline, http://timeline.leagueoflegends.com/ - we wanted to remind everyone about how significantly the game has evolved and will continue to evolve because we are constantly "actively working" on many things.

But the underlying reason for a lot of the issues you have cited with concern is that Riot has grown a lot in order to expand our capabilities to support tens of millions of users around the world, and ensuring that all of the multitude of things that we do on a daily basis are always awesome and fully aligned with our goal of delighting you all with awesome, is simply put, difficult. The good news is that we are a company that learns very quickly and has amazing people at all levels of the company who care deeply about this mission. We WANT to deliver awesome with everything that we do. When we don't, we take it very seriously.

I can say with confidence, that this is one thing that separates us from many other companies - from top to bottom, the thing that matters most to us is delighting our players and that's what drives our decisions. When we do something that deviates from that, it is likely due to sub-optimal execution, or misalignment internally, rather than any deliberate attempt to be not awesome. It's hard to demonstrate this, but I think the players who have come to events and met us or visited the office can vouch for these things, but ideally we'll have more ways to communicate and reinforce these ideals in a more scaleable way in the future (we are actively working on that =p).



The real reason we don't address some of these things head on, is because often times we don't have great answers and/or are working on great long term solutions that aren't ready for daylight yet.

We have learned over time (from community feedback) that saying we are working on something really isn't a great answer, because time is a very important factor that has a different perception depending on who is looking at the situation and whose perspective we are looking at it from. Example: if a character is slightly OP, say has a 2% higher win rate than our average, (by tending to win too many matchups, or be too versatile, etc), the severity of the issue can be different depending on who is looking at the situation. Competitive players may think it is a major issue due it this character impacting the meta (picks, bans, lane allocations, etc), while many other players may not care at all. Or, our design team may think that a noob stompy champion (say, Tryndamere!!1) who is not frequently used at high level play, is a much more important issue to address because it impacts a large % of players, but the competitive tier doesn't really have this come up on their radar, etc.

The key is that things are relative based on the viewers perspective (any physics or philosophy majors out there?).

Now, that's a design example, but we may have a similar situation re: priorities that hit other issues, like pricing, development priorities, etc. Sometimes we "stop gap" until we have a better long term solution.

A great example is pricing. We haven't been fully happy with our pricing communication, approach and execution because believe it or not, pricing is not something that receives much attention from most senior people at the company. We're focused on creating awesome - like developing E-sports, building game features, improving our content or intellectual property, building the organization, launching internationally, etc.

Pricing, aside from us saying "let's have the game be free forever and never sell power" has largely been an after thought because our view is that if we create awesome, then our players will reward us. That has held true.

Thus, if we botch the retirement of skins, or don't have enough sales, it is really due to organizational momentum and the lack of real leadership driving a directional change based on your guys feedback. The good news is, for those who care about pricing and those types of things, is that we have real, dedicated leadership here now who can focus on doing a better job of ensuring your needs are better met from that perspective.

Now, that doesn't mean that all skins will now cost 0 IP, or something equally drastic, but what it DOES mean is that there will be a lot more careful consideration, focus and communication with you all about what we're doing there.

With pretty much anything that sucks that we do, the upstream "cause" can be traced to that - the lack of sufficient mindshare because we probably think something else is more important - until we find the right person or grow the organization in such a way as to enable us to do all that we need to do in parallel.

There's no conspiracy where we're sitting around twisting our mustaches, if anything, the only mustache twisting we do is in regards to "creating more awesome" and figuring out how to delight you. Ask any Rioter, and they will tell you the same thing. Pretty much all of our focus internally is on that.



That's really just not the case. The problem simply relates to more "noise" and more things to do. We now are the largest online game in the world and serve (literally) tens of millions of gamers. Scale is hard, but we think we're up to the challenge and we appreciate your support.

You holding faith that we WILL do better is important to us, and don't be afraid to call us out when we're not as awesome as we usually are - because it is critical for us to keep our execution bar as high (or even higher) than it has always been.

The cool thing is, in all seriousness, we do have tons of awesome in store and our capabilities are stronger than ever. The Season 3 teaser from today is a sneak peak in this direction, but we have a lot more awesome coming that I don't want to spoil with a message board post (because the announcements or the releases will be 100000000x cooler).

Hopefully this was helpful and thanks for all of your patience while we keep trying to do an even better job for you guys.

On a personal note, my ELO has dropped from about 1650 to 1400 because I'm focusing so much more on trying to build our organizational capabilities than I am at keeping my LOL skills sharp - another tragedy that I look forward to remedying (so trust me when I say I'm motivated)!
tl;dr: Im blaming you guys for my shortcomings in ranked


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Tryndamere

President / Co-Founder

Follow MarcMerrill on Twitter

08-06-2012
2 of 92 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by EndlessCycle View Post
tl;dr
Haha


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Baksteent

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryndamere View Post
Actively working!
How about you actively work on the EUW servers? NA would have been up for a long time by now.


Edit: Now you are here anyways, explain why EUW will ALWAYS think we are left behind? You kinda made it seem that way, also you might wanna reply in EU forums every now and then?


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Sinfell

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Oh, thanks Tryndamere. Answered some questions.


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Communist Poppy

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tryndamere View Post
Haha
Well how else do you expect people to post on the same page as you while still staying on topic?


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Falcoooo

Member

08-06-2012

O sht tryndamere repsonded
holllllllllllllly


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Zerglinator

Senior Member

08-06-2012

Hail Tryndamere!


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Blood Elf

Senior Member

08-06-2012

bump for truth