why pick AD teemo over AP?

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Herald of Loki

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Senior Member

06-25-2012

I can only assume that all of the AP Teemo h8ers have either

A: never seen a good, skilled, competent AP Teemo before, as AP Teemo outclasses AD Teemo in most every regard with the exception that AD Teemo can take turrets more quickly & more consistently than AP Teemo simply due to the AD.

B: that the AP Teemo h8ers who used to play him as an AP champion simply don't play a style that plays to Teemos obvious AP based strengths.

couple of things to end with just ftr:

Teemo actually has very good AP ratios .8 on Blinding Dart, .7 on Toxic Shot as DOT & .8 again on his shrooms as DOT as well. He can very easily do 1000 damage per shroom while having a large amount of magic pen & other utility, much MUCH more if you just want to nuke, that obviously goes for all his damaging skills also

& those very solid AP ratios? they're the only ratios he has, no AD ratios to speak of on AD Teemo. you are building against his grain to build him AD. I can only assume that people most often prefer the simplicity of the much less effective AD Teemo over the complexity & skill requirement of the more effective AP counterpart

good AP ratios vs. no AD ratios, is it really so hard to see?


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iElementz

Senior Member

06-25-2012

i like to get a dorans blade early for easier last hitting, then get all the attack speed/ap items and then for my last item i may get something like a IE or Bloodthirster since ur attack speed is around 2-2.5 that 80-100 damage on a auto attack does amazing things with the speed and poison, been very successful doing this with teemo top or carry bot


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thepantsparty

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Senior Member

06-25-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by APocalypticTeemo View Post
Teemo actually has very good AP ratios .8 on Blinding Dart, .7 on Toxic Shot as DOT & .8 again on his shrooms as DOT as well. He can very easily do 1000 damage per shroom while having a large amount of magic pen & other utility, much MUCH more if you just want to nuke, that obviously goes for all his damaging skills also

& those very solid AP ratios? they're the only ratios he has, no AD ratios to speak of on AD Teemo. you are building against his grain to build him AD. I can only assume that people most often prefer the simplicity of the much less effective AD Teemo over the complexity & skill requirement of the more effective AP counterpart

good AP ratios vs. no AD ratios, is it really so hard to see?
Some AD carries have no AD ratios, or very bad ones on few skills (see: Tristana, Twitch, Ashe, Kog'Maw, Corki), so AD/AP ratios aren't the sole factor in determining how to build a champion.

The problem with Teemo as AP is that in order for him to have respectable effective AP ratios you have to ensure the other team steps on a mushroom at a useful time. If you can get them to step on 1-2 mushrooms during a team fight? Awesome, he does great damage and brings solid utility. They step on a mushroom while you're in no position to capitalize on it? It's basically wasted. Didn't have time to set up before a fight, or the fight doesn't go where you hoped it would? Then you're bringing a medium cooldown blind and a low damage DoT, and that's about it.

0.7 AP on his DoT looks good until you realize that's over the entire duration. Unless you can hit each enemy in sequence and cycle through allowing the DoT to fully tick, it doesn't compare to a true AP champion that can cast a spell with a 0.7 AP ratio a few times during an encounter.


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Cheebeechoobza

Member

06-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluffyknowsyou View Post
On hit items like wit's end, malady, and madred's bloodrazors are the only damage items worth putting on teemo if you play to win.
This. You shouldn't build Teemo as AD OR AP. You should build him as attack speed + on hit effects.

It's true that Teemo has nothing that scales on AD, but toxic dart does scale on attack speed (it deals damage on hit as well as over time) and that's the reason for building him with these items. Wit's End gives magic resist and Bloodrazor gives a bit of armor which helps offset his squishiness.

Attack speed Teemo also has harder to counter damage, since there's a fair bit of both physical and magical damage going out, so an opponent can't counter his damage by buying just magic resist or just armor. Bloodrazor even counters those who stack health. Furthermore, malady will break through some of the opponents' magic resist, and it'll help out your AP carry as well.

Teemo isn't a mage. I don't care how much AP you're stacking, you're not going to burst someone down with a blinding dart and one or two toxic darts (which is probably all you'll have time to get off with no attack speed.) Building AP sacrifices armor and magic resist, so you won't last long. And hoping that someone walks on your mushrooms isn't a very reliable strategy.


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roughneck65

Senior Member

06-26-2012

I personally like ad/ms teemo. I see his mushrooms as warning pain in your butt devices.


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Wixen

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Junior Member

06-26-2012

Frozen Mallet - Bloodrazor vs. items is good.


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xCry0x

Senior Member

06-26-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxijazz View Post
Teemo is usually sent top lane as a counter to the common bruisers that go up there. While he is a counter, that does not mean you can't build like what you are countering. I would go wriggles, frozen mallet, wits end, atmas, and then nashor's tooth somewhere in there. This gives you a strong slow, some lifesteal for after the fight to heal up, armor, MR, CDR (more shrooms OP), and health.

When a fight starts you are the best peel character for your carries if they know what kiting is. Keep auto attacking whoever is trying to kill your carry. Before anyone dives on them, place a shroom and keep placing if they reposition like they should.

People also look at Teemo as very squishy and may try and kill you. When they realize they can't, its already too late.
This

Anyone who says teemo can play ad carry does not have a fundamental understanding of what makes an ad carry work. The only AD carry aspect of teemo is his passive after he has gone invisible. This is next to useless in team fights.

You might as well play annie as an ad carry because at least then you would have the 2nd longest base range in the game and the ability to hard cc stun the entire team or play anivia (3rd longest base range after cait & annie) because you could ice wall their team, aoe slow AND STUN which is a 10x better peel than 2 seconds of being blind provided by teemo or crossing your fingers in hopes someone walks over a mushroom that you last second placed in the middle of a fight.

BTW Annie range on auto attacks = 625 Cait is 650, anivia is 600 teemo is 500.

-edit-

Want to clarify, not saying you should play ad annie or anivia but to compare with the viability of ad teemo.

Ad anivia - 100 higher range and an ult that does an aoe 20% slow/attack speed debuff and 160 damage per second.

Teemo - 100 less range and an auto attack magic dmg poison (e) which does a max of 160 dmg (without ap) over 4 seconds, aka 40 damage per second and is single target

Therefor if you are going to argue that teemo poison helps him as an ad carry, anivia's ult does 4x the damage, is an aoe and slows attack speed/movement WHILE she can auto attack at 100 longer range, therefor you are better off playing anivia as an ad carry than teemo.

Think anivia is a dumb ad carry? probably, and this is why I think teemo is a completely dumb-fu** choice for ad carry.


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LastStaX

Senior Member

06-26-2012

could a teemo player explain to me, why you would pick teemo over someone like Kayle for a top lane ranged champ. the way i see it, teemo is extremely safe laner post six but brings nothing to his team out of lane, while Kayle can bring an amazing utility ult and still play the same role in lane as teemo.


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yodaz12

Member

06-26-2012

teemo has more dmg output than kayle. also, don't under estimate the shrooms, even on an ad/as build. they give map awareness, slow opponents, allow for engage, teleports, random kills, etc.

1 word for why ad > ap teemo; cleanse.

ap teemo depends on his shrooms to kill. if they cleanse, u go qq. u also don't get the kill when they go off the screen and u can't chase them. That's not to say the hybrid isn't good, but ap teemo is awful. Even with the hybrid though, u want more on the ad side than ap, the dmg just scales better that way. Think about the dmg comparison of getting phantom dancer vs an ap item, not to mention what it does for your spd.


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Darmon

Senior Member

06-26-2012

People build all kinds of dumb stuff, even if it isnt ideal. AD Teemo is no exception.