How many games do you expect to play before you reach your true Elo?

< 10 Games 180 1.63%
11-40 Games 819 7.42%
41-80 Games 1,162 10.52%
81-120 Games 1,737 15.73%
121-160 Games 664 6.01%
161-200 Games 929 8.41%
200-399 Games 1,703 15.42%
400-599 Games 1,086 9.83%
600-799 Games 456 4.13%
800-999 Games 170 1.54%
1000+ Games 2,139 19.37%
Voters: 11045. You may not vote on this poll

Help Riot improve matchmaking! Looking for examples of bad matchmaking

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Slayer860

Senior Member

02-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by C00LST0RYBR0 View Post
Please remove the inital placement system. Why?
The players that really benefit from this system are the "highest ranked 1%" of all players.

- These players don't need this system in the first place, as they play the most, have tons of high ranked players to duo q with. So they'll get back up easily.
- It creates too much variation around the 1200 (mid range) due to the randomness of the system. Basicly I had accounts start out at 900 and others at 1500. Of course you'll get back to your real elo but the displacement caused by this system are huge.

So why do we have this system that only helps 1% of the players, that don't actually need this help in the first place.

Please remove this system.
Yeah I don't understand the Elo boost either. It makes sure that getting out of the low 1000-1300 is almost entirely down to luck.


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Sarg338

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Senior Member

02-15-2012

One other suggestion I can submit is that you could make Duo Queue only possible if, say, the 2 people Duo Queueing are 50 Elo or so away from each other both ways (That way, you don't have a 1300 duo queueing with a 1700).

Has there been any discussion in the office about implementing something like this?


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Lyte

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Lead Social Systems Designer

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02-15-2012
9 of 173 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by C00LST0RYBR0 View Post
Please remove the inital placement system. Why?
The players that really benefit from this system are the "highest ranked 1%" of all players.

- These players don't need this system in the first place, as they play the most, have tons of high ranked players to duo q with. So they'll get back up easily.
- It creates too much variation around the 1200 (mid range) due to the randomness of the system. Basicly I had accounts start out at 900 and others at 1500. Of course you'll get back to your real elo but the displacement caused by this system are huge.

So why do we have this system that only helps 1% of the players, that don't actually need this help in the first place.

Please remove this system.
I'm very curious about this. For people with multiple accounts that have played Ranked matches, please send me your Summoner Names and your current Elos on the accounts so I can see if the accounts landed at very different Elo ranges after placement matches.


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Thaiya

Senior Member

02-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverHellion View Post
Doubt true ELO will be seen in very many people. There are 9 variables in every game, its impossible to tell.
Good point. Don't forget that there's also any number of variables inherent in the player in question. I, for one, have some matches in which I frequently make poor judgment calls, don't position well and I don't time many of my skillshots properly, and others in which I'm in a "zen mode" of sorts--I successfully snipe opponents with long-range ults, steal important objectives like Dragon and Baron, and get fed overall.


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Teemo Support GG

Senior Member

02-15-2012

THanks for this thread, i'm really interested to see what comes of the data.


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Alma Beoulve

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Senior Member

02-15-2012

Your matchmaking is almost perfect, Riot. It's just that we don't like to lose. Don't listen to General Discussion.

Edit by me: What? -__-' I wasn't saying anything bad nor do I mean anything negative. I think your matchmaking is good, we just don't like to lose, that's all. So we blame it on the algorithm.


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Slayer860

Senior Member

02-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by C00LST0RYBR0 View Post
Dumping the elo loss onto afk/leavers would be a good start... or atleast part of it.
I love this idea but sadly they will never implement anything like it due to abuse (which could probably be solved but too much effort for them).


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Lyte

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Lead Social Systems Designer

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02-15-2012
10 of 173 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by C00LST0RYBR0 View Post
Dumping the elo loss onto afk/leavers would be a good start... or atleast part of it.
My concern is if players know that Elo points are distributed onto AFK/leavers, that a portion of players will rage and be extremely toxic with the intention of making someone quit to take the brunt of the Elo loss.


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DizzyStorm

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Senior Member

02-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by C00LST0RYBR0 View Post
Please remove the inital placement system. Why?
The players that really benefit from this system are the "highest ranked 1%" of all players.

- These players don't need this system in the first place, as they play the most, have tons of high ranked players to duo q with. So they'll get back up easily.
- It creates too much variation around the 1200 (mid range) due to the randomness of the system. Basicly I had accounts start out at 900 and others at 1500. Of course you'll get back to your real elo but the displacement caused by this system are huge.

So why do we have this system that only helps 1% of the players, that don't actually need this help in the first place.

Please remove this system.
Exactly. I only had a rough start and lost only 6/10 of my first few games and somehow got down to 900-1000 elo range. That only took like 2 days. It took me over 3 months of gameplay to get to where I feel "comfortable" now (1300). Also if there HAS to be an initial Elo Boost, make it so it's NOT at 1200 elo. That way if you get lucky with your first 10 Games it's not auto Gold.


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C00LST0RYBR0

Senior Member

02-15-2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarg338 View Post
And Elo ranking like this will always be flawed, I believe, because Elo is mainly used in 1v1 games (Starcraft, Chess, etc).

All 4 people can do really good, but can lose just because of 1 person feeding, AFKing, etc.

EDIT: well... seems like I was a little late xD
This is actually not a problem, as all random factors are distributed among both teams. The odds of bad and good teams average out after playing enough games going closer and closer to 50/50.

However, this becomes a problem, when there is a limited amount of games, that give an increased benefit, as for instance the initial placement system provides. Which is why I think it is bad and should be removed.

The randomness over 10 games cant be controlled.