Someone has to be better than average, and someone has to be worse.

First Riot Post
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DeathByOnion

Senior Member

12-05-2011

Does this mean those better should be nerfed, and those worse should be buffed?

I personally feel being better than average is not enough for a nerf, however there is a line between a strong pick and an OP champion. Same with those on the weak side.

Discuss?


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Jeshhy

Junior Member

12-05-2011

I don't think any of them need to be better or worse. It should be up to the summoner how well they play them. Otherwise everyone will just play the better champions and the others will be ignored. Or if there are better champions in one team, and not in another, then they will win, regardless on summoner skill.


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Morello

Lead Designer

12-05-2011
1 of 1 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathByOnion View Post
Does this mean those better should be nerfed, and those worse should be buffed?

I personally feel being better than average is not enough for a nerf, however there is a line between a strong pick and an OP champion. Same with those on the weak side.

Discuss?
Especially if there's counters, I agree. This is why we don't mess with Morgana despite her high ban rate (send Talon in that lane and watch the fireworks...). Meta can change power of champions, and if alternate strategies and other options are available, we're fine with champions being considered better or stronger for awhile.


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Yummines

Member

12-05-2011

a champion only needs nerfs for sure if there are no counters, or there are very few counters to them


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RedPlanet

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Senior Member

12-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Especially if there's counters, I agree. This is why we don't mess with Morgana despite her high ban rate (send Talon in that lane and watch the fireworks...). Meta can change power of champions, and if alternate strategies and other options are available, we're fine with champions being considered better or stronger for awhile.
I feel like Morgana is a bad example though, the problem people have with her is not her laning - anyone can counter lane Morgana by dodging Q and free farming.

Even her counters have a hard time keeping her from farming, and then she's very strong in teamfights, which is where the "strong character" perception comes from.

I guess it would help if her black shield didn't make her completely immune to physical CC (no way to break it.) Then she would have more direct counters.


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SparrZ

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Senior Member

12-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Especially if there's counters, I agree. This is why we don't mess with Morgana despite her high ban rate (send Talon in that lane and watch the fireworks...). Meta can change power of champions, and if alternate strategies and other options are available, we're fine with champions being considered better or stronger for awhile.
Meta can change the power of a champion but with some champions numbers so low (To avoid OP-ness), or skills out classed by newer champions it does make you wonder if the goal of balance in a progressive game is attainable. I have always thought that you guys do a nice job keeping things in the ballpark.....

Also... what do you think about Johnny Mundo?! http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1564902


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SheepKing

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Senior Member

12-05-2011

but morello, i dont understand how a champion can have that much cc, utility, damage and farming ability at once.

i dont see how a champion like fizz, with that much mouvement ability can be that strong

and i dont understand how a stealth remake is taking that long to be done.

any explanation?


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kooliosauce

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Member

12-05-2011

Completely false even with basic math. consider the set {17,17,17,17,17,17,17} the average of these numbers is? which of them is above average?


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Zinthros

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Recruiter

12-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Especially if there's counters, I agree. This is why we don't mess with Morgana despite her high ban rate (send Talon in that lane and watch the fireworks...). Meta can change power of champions, and if alternate strategies and other options are available, we're fine with champions being considered better or stronger for awhile.
This is the single best Morello post I have ever read.

You've shied away from balancing based on meta and allowed disruptive champions (which mid elo cries about because they make the game less clear cut "X goes here, Y goes there")

Glad to hear Kassadin won't be nerfed because he can be countered hard with a sustainy bruiser or sustainy mage in mid.


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Rammblin1

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Member

12-05-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morello View Post
Especially if there's counters, I agree. This is why we don't mess with Morgana despite her high ban rate (send Talon in that lane and watch the fireworks...). Meta can change power of champions, and if alternate strategies and other options are available, we're fine with champions being considered better or stronger for awhile.
If by watch the fireworks you mean watch morgana sit back and peacefully kill everything with her W...