[RIOT] Just why?

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HolyAvatar

Senior Member

06-08-2010

Why did you nerf TF?
Don't take it badly, just explain why and maybe you'll have people to agree with you.

Right now by not commenting the issue, you are fueling the rage of many players.

You did something, it should have a reason. What is it?


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MarkedRaptor

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Senior Member

06-08-2010

They said because wild cards wasn't being used and most AD builds just forgot about the spell all together, said it made him akward to play.

They didn't realise that now he fails as either or now, or even a hybrid doesn't work very well.

he's not terrible, but there's just no point in picking him over other heroes, kinda like teemo.


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Phreak

Shoutcaster

06-08-2010
1 of 1 Riot Posts

We wanted to make AP Cardmaster more viable. We felt Stacked Deck was a little too powerful as it was. If you do the math on the ability compared to something like Wuju style (do the gold cost of the stats gained), Stacked Deck is way above it. I don't believe champions should only be good because of one ability. This was also the theory behind Kayle's change this patch. Perhaps the ultimate wasn't nerfed enough to compensate, but she now has multiple fun abilities as opposed to only one viable skill.


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Gaeb

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Senior Member

06-08-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
Perhaps the ultimate wasn't nerfed enough to compensate, but she now has multiple fun abilities as opposed to only one viable skill.
Two... her old Q was also decent.

That said, remake is amazing. I might still suggest minor buff to Q and making E's splash/extra damage not impact towers. LOVE Kayle remake.

TF nerf is fine. /thread


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seth2113

Senior Member

06-09-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkedRaptor View Post
They said because wild cards wasn't being used and most AD builds just forgot about the spell all together, said it made him akward to play.

They didn't realise that now he fails as either or now, or even a hybrid doesn't work very well.

he's not terrible, but there's just no point in picking him over other heroes, kinda like teemo.
lol?


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ZyloWolfBane

Senior Member

06-09-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
We wanted to make AP Cardmaster more viable. We felt Stacked Deck was a little too powerful as it was. If you do the math on the ability compared to something like Wuju style (do the gold cost of the stats gained), Stacked Deck is way above it. I don't believe champions should only be good because of one ability. This was also the theory behind Kayle's change this patch. Perhaps the ultimate wasn't nerfed enough to compensate, but she now has multiple fun abilities as opposed to only one viable skill.
I did always want to use him as an AP champ instead of Attack Speed like everyone else, but then wouldnt it have just been better to rework PaC or Stacked Deck to reflect that instead of nerfing a previously key skill into oblivion?

I mean granted a few items make up for the difference in Attack speed quite easily to the point where it makes the whole argument rediculous but if any particular item overshadows the usefulness of a skill (Like even Zerkers greaves for example) thats supposed to do the same thing then why even have it at all?

Rather than nerfing Stacked Deck and making it useless it probably would have been better to just do something else with it.

I would have proposed for Stacked Deck to passively increase AD or AP by a small fraction or perhaps create a short term buff that activates off of PaC and has a different effect for each card.

Just seems like there should have been a more creative change made rather than just hammering it into the ground when it wasnt necessary.


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Gooze

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Senior Member

06-09-2010

If you wanted to make AP TF viable again, why not jsut revert him to his original form. That was when AP TF was viable. Now, you cant even play BOTH styles.


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SweetTooth

Senior Member

06-11-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
We wanted to make AP Cardmaster more viable. We felt Stacked Deck was a little too powerful as it was. If you do the math on the ability compared to something like Wuju style (do the gold cost of the stats gained), Stacked Deck is way above it. I don't believe champions should only be good because of one ability. This was also the theory behind Kayle's change this patch. Perhaps the ultimate wasn't nerfed enough to compensate, but she now has multiple fun abilities as opposed to only one viable skill.
Yeah cause stacked deck did so much damage. 180 MAGIC damage at level 5. So at most you are what? level 9 before you get that maxed? ANd you need some items to actually get some attack speed up. Stacked deck wasnt that much to begin with. With stacked deck and full AS runes it took me getting to level 4 to actually get past 1.0 attack speed. Now if we want to talk damage lets talk about parrley... 6 second cooldown and at max level and if you are fed it can easily do more than 1000 damage. Even if you get TF to 2.5 attack speed in 6 seconds the most you are getting 2 hits off so an extra 360 damage? Only on top of what you can already do with TF. ANd if you have 2.5 attack speed you certainly arent going to do as much damage as a fed pirate doing 1000 damage on a 6 second cooldown. He doesnt even have to fight. Pop in hit the squishy for half health run away for 6 seconds and kill the squishy with a second hit. AND parrrley has a bigger range than TF auto attack.

Summary: Cut the BS phreak on your math on TF and other people. TF is gimped now and the worst CARRY in the game.


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Grim Moniker

Member

06-11-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phreak View Post
We wanted to make AP Cardmaster more viable.
Making AD TF worse doesn't make AP TF any more viable.

It just makes AD TF worse.


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Lynxion

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Senior Member

06-11-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetTooth View Post
Yeah cause stacked deck did so much damage. 180 MAGIC damage at level 5. So at most you are what? level 9 before you get that maxed? ANd you need some items to actually get some attack speed up. Stacked deck wasnt that much to begin with. With stacked deck and full AS runes it took me getting to level 4 to actually get past 1.0 attack speed. Now if we want to talk damage lets talk about parrley... 6 second cooldown and at max level and if you are fed it can easily do more than 1000 damage. Even if you get TF to 2.5 attack speed in 6 seconds the most you are getting 2 hits off so an extra 360 damage? Only on top of what you can already do with TF. ANd if you have 2.5 attack speed you certainly arent going to do as much damage as a fed pirate doing 1000 damage on a 6 second cooldown. He doesnt even have to fight. Pop in hit the squishy for half health run away for 6 seconds and kill the squishy with a second hit. AND parrrley has a bigger range than TF auto attack.

Summary: Cut the BS phreak on your math on TF and other people. TF is gimped now and the worst CARRY in the game.
Teemo and Evelynn are worse, but I guess Evelynn doesn't classify as a carry.


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