Hidden message reveals Vayne threat to LeBlanc

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larkhill

Senior Member

07-02-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by MajesticRaven View Post
I say: The Void is behind Kalmaha, and the assassination, or atleast some third party. Swain was quoted as 'this is a declaration of war'.

As much as i think he would love to make Demacia look bad, i don't think murdering a city-state leader is worth a mining town, and I don't think Swain would kill Darkwill so suddenly and then immediately declare war, it'd make the transition incredibly difficult, and wouldn't exactly be the best way to get promoted.

He'd like for it to go smoothly, but someone has forced his hand, so he's reacting accordingly.
disagree. its playing out exactly like ww1 where swain is hitler and leblanc is all hitlers evil henchman (i guess goebbels would be the closest comparison).

swain is one of, if not the, best general in the noxian army, and one of the best. he's also the most popular. he's a league champion. he has more popularity than most people in all of runeterra, let alone other noxian generals. getting the crown once darkwill is gone would be easy given a few things happen:

1. there needs to be a war. he's a general. the people wont allow him to be the ruler if theres no war to fight. it wouldnt make sense. and right now, all things r settled within the league. by assassinating darkwill and leading the fight to blame demacia for it, he's starting a war, becoming the figurehead for the cause and giving someone people associate the cause with. hitler did the same thing...

2. with war breaking out and the people accepting swain as the leader for the anti-demacia campaign, swain needs the higher-ups to accept him as well. this is where the league comes in. the league influences everything and everyone. getting the people to accept him is easy. he's leading the campaign against an enemy the people already hate with a passion and are willing to blame them for this. with the leagues help, he can get the higher-ups to make him the ruler of noxus. the league knows he wants this.

remember, from swains judgement, it says the league doesnt arbitrarily choose sides, but it does choose sides. with swain easily able to frame demacia, he kills jarvan the 4th for violating protocol and assassinating darkwill. the league is forced to make peace between noxus and demacia (if they dont, another war breaks out and the league stops being the middleman for all political progress. the league doesnt want that) and to make peace, they take the ruler of demacia and swain, the head of the anti-demacia campaign and make them sign a peace treaty again. at this point swain is basically the ruler of noxus.

look for the campaign against demacia (and framing jarvan the 4th for darkwills death) i nthe next few joj's.

i think i should get a cookie if this comes true...


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sogy

Senior Member

07-02-2011

i put it all together, but thought you might have to switch words around i ended up getting,
BEWARE BLACK ROSE, CURIOUS VAYNE MIGHT SEE JUDGEMENT THREAT RECORDS.
just a thought, not sure what judgement would be but it sounds good so idk,
try moving words around and see if you can get anything better.


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Saint Foxx

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Senior Member

07-02-2011

Reading all of this, I can promise you that Vayne is the true threat against the Black Rose. The last sentence in the letter should be taken at face value and that makes it blatently obvious as to who it's from:

Quote:
accEpting it only as a gift from a friendly admirer, i would suggest against snake skin though it rubs irritatingly close” – ZaineDraconis
In conjunction of "ZaineDraconis" translating to "Beautiful Snake" as well as her previous background in information gathering, on TOP of her connections to the Black Rose, the letter HAS to be from Cassiopia.

Vayne would never warn a practitioner of the dark arts of ANYTHING. She's got a vendetta against all evil, so why would she help people that are?


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Master Phnog

Junior Member

07-02-2011

1) What was written in the letter that General de Couteau received?

Whatever it was he went alone to meet the Swain and LeBlanc, telling only Cassiopeia where he was going.


2) Why the letter?

No body has been found, so either the corpse has been discretely disposed of or there is no corpse. Swain is the master tactician, everything he does is planned and has a reason behind it. So does he gain any advantage from not letting the body be found?

The advantage in discretely disposing of a body would be to dispose of the evidence along with it. In that case why the letter? Surely between them Swain and LeBlanc could have come up with a way of assasinating General de Couteau without any need for the letter they would have no control over once sent. A letter that could be used against them. The letter was clearly marked with the sigel of the black rose so they weren't hiding who the letter was from. Therefore they had no reason to fear leaving evidence pointing directly at them meeting with General de Couteau just before he dissappeared.


3) Cassiopeia has the letter, yet there has been no reprisal from either Cassiopeia or Katarina. Why?

Perhaps Cassiopeia has kept the letter to herself and Katarina doesn't know. If so she has a reason to keep it from her sister, so either Swain and LeBlanc have something over her to keep her quiet or she is willingly collaborating for whatever reason.

If Katarina does know, she has done nothing we know of to act on this knowledge and did not oppose Swain entering the high command that she too is a member of. Again, either she is being coerced (and Katarina does not seem the type to be easily intimidated) or she too is collaborating.

There has been the assumption in many posts that General de Couteau is dead, perhaps he is not dead and is being held as hostage to blackmail Cassiopeia and Katarina. Or perhaps he too is in on the conspiracy for whatever reason. Another possibility is that a third party killed General de Couteau and Swain/LeBlanc had nothing to do with the murder i.e. it was not part of their plan. This seems unlikely though given Swain's ambition and subsquent events.


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larkhill

Senior Member

07-02-2011

my guess is du couteau found out about swain and the black rose wanting the crown and left to deal with it personally. he knew that he couldnt stop swain from gaining the crown from his position as a general. any sign of war and swain would easily take charge and lead noxus through it, easily taking the crown. he has enough of a following to do so. du couteau can do a lot more investigating and stop him by himself than he ever could as a general alongside swain.

swain more than likely has a plan for dealing with the noxian elite and the du couteau family. he'd be foolish not to. i doubt he has a plan for dealing with a rogue investigator like du couteau is now, assuming he's alive.

my guess is the letter told kat and cass to stay put and act as if nothing is wrong. they can simply go along with whatever happens. this gives du couteau the perfect opportunity to investigate undetected. kat/cass arent stupid. they may be evil but they are still part of the noxian elite and would prefer to stay that way. any challenge to the throne is a challenge to them and who better to deal with swain than another noxian general, and one of the more famous ones at that...


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Master Phnog

Junior Member

07-02-2011

Could be, but the letter that was left with Cassiopeia was not written by the General and we know what was in the letter.

A couple of key moments from Cassiopeia's judgement;

"In blood red ink, someone had penned: “Transcendence Way, the Ivory Ward, 5:00 PM.” Below it was a stamped image of a black rose."


“I have been summoned. It is a grave matter, but one that I cannot refuse. “ (General de Couteau)


“Mistress Cassiopeia,” he began, “Your father has…”
She cut him off, “Spare me your excuses, fool! How did it happen!”
“We were in the market,” he stammered, “Your father slipped away.”
“And I ordered you to shadow him, did I not?” sneered Cassiopeia.


She advanced, fastening her claws securely around his neck. She lifted his worthless body and suddenly, a shattered pocket watch fell out of his pocket. The watch’s hands stopped dead at a quarter past five. “This was all we found,” he croaked.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wonder who are the Black rose to summon a general of the noxian high command in such a way that he cannot refuse. Why can't he refuse? What power do they/did they have over him?

Then the pocket watch left behind stopped at a quarter past 5, again if it was left behind as evidence Swain probably had a reason or knew there wouldn't be conseqeunces for leaving evidence. Between the letter and the watch 15 minutes after the meeting it is enough evidence for Cssiopeia to implicate Swain and she knows it. But still no reaction yet. What else do Cassiopeia and Katarina know? Are they biding their time and hatching their own plan? How powerful are the black rose already that Swain or LeBlanc weren't just straight up arrested or how weak the grip on power of Darkwill and his allies that didn't do this? How much influence do they already have within Noxus? Then there's Cassiopeia likely being responsible for the letter in the JoJ and sending convert messages to LeBlanc... if she is all seems to point to some kind of alliance betwwen the de Couteau family and the black rose.


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Barbooch

Senior Member

07-02-2011

There's some speculation Swain was part of the Noxian Royalty before Darkwill came to power and stopped the Black Rose from ruling so it would make sense why the two would work together, why Swain, despite being maybe the greatest Noxian general, just barely gained his high position, and the ring in LeBlanc's judgment. Also someone mentioned a possible reference to Shaco killing General Du Countue (yeah I know I probly spelled it wrong) so maybe he was hired or something. Purely speculation, but on a different note, Emperor Swain skin anyone? xD


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Mister Seer

Junior Member

07-02-2011

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSniper77 View Post
ZaineDraconis can be broken up into Zaine and Draconis. Zaine can mean Gracious God or Beautiful, while Draconis means Dragon or Serpent. To cut to the point, "ZaineDraconis" could and is likely meant to be interpreted as (in this case) "Beautiful Serpent". Given the clue at the end of the letter he/she wrote, I'll give you one guess as to which champion the name implies.

So, my two cents on it is that this was a message to LeBlanc from Cassiopea warning her that the threat of vayne is evident, and that caution is advised.

My interpretation of the grammar of the warning message:
BEWARE: JUDGEMENT RECORDS CURIOUS, MIGHT SEE BLACK ROSE THREAT: VAYNE.

This means that either someone has been going through the judgement records or that officials in control of the records are curiously going through them, and that the end result could mean meeting vayne face to face (it also implies that LeBlanc has a reason to fear people going through the records, confirming her dark past).

anyways, just my thoughts on it. Oh, and props to the writers, as you have now found a way to really catch our attention. Glad you finally found a way
You're a genius ^-^
This is the first post who clearly relate Cassiopea to Leblanc/Swain/etc. After reading it, I asked myself: why would the snake lady helps the Black Rose? This sentence always pop in my head:
"maYbe if you would be iNclined in find a new outfit. ofcourse, accEpting it only as a gift from a friendly admirer, i would suggest against snake skin though it rubs irritatingly close".
What if Cassiopea was working for the Black Rose, in exchange of what they would make her an human again? And if that happen.... Human Cassiopea skin? <3

Now that we know who wrote the letter, my question is: How did Cassopea knows what Vayne is up to? I know how her father used her when she was an human, but now she's a snake, and Vayne is not really the kind of person you can charm or spy...

This is all verry interesting, i was reading everyone's post like it was a thriller. Cant wait to see how this will end!


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Xenodyne

Senior Member

07-02-2011

Somehow I don't think that Vayne would help out LeBlanc.

For all we know, the witch that murdered Vayne's parents was part of the Black Rose organization. As a matter of fact, considering Vayne's lineage, this was probably the case.



I think it may have been Swain who sent the note. Though I'm tempted to believe it may be someone else. If you look at the name, Zaine is very similar to Swain, but Draconis usually refers to a dragon.


O-O DRAGON IS TRYING TO SEND SECRET MESSAGES!!! I kid.


EDIT: got fully up to speed on this thread. Ignore what I said, Cassiopia sent the letter.



A little off topic, but does anyone think it might have been Vayne who ambushed the Noxian unit that Swain is pissed about? Considering the landscape and the way the deaths were carried out....it was prolly her..


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larkhill

Senior Member

07-02-2011

y would swain be mad that boram, or any noxians were killed? on the contrary... swain is happy to blame anything and everything onto demacia. the more stuff to blame, the easier it is to start a war and ultimately kill jarvan, as well as take the noxian crown.

vayne has no reason to contact the black rose or leblanc unless its to warn them. she is a night huntress. she kills silently and efficiently. she doesnt send out messages beforehand warning people. she simply goes out and does her job. in this joj, she contacted leblanc and leblanc replied that she understands the threats and will reward vayne for her loyalty. being rewarded for her loyalty means vayne is partnerign with leblanc, and by extension, swain.

the bigger question is y is leblanc/the black rose helping swain get the noxian crown. what do they have to gain by being an underground sect under swains rule instead of borams. they've done better as an underground sect than they ever did as the a public figure...