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-   Twisted Treeline (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/forumdisplay.php?f=49)
-   -   Why this IS a new map and not TT (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2695924)

CaptainAMorgan 10-18-2012 02:35 PM

Why this IS a new map and not TT
Anyone trying to say this "new" TT is a remake with preserving the old one in mind never played the original.

TT was more of a 3v3 SR (DOTA) gametype. Kill the ancient/nexus/thingy and win by out macroing/microing/teamworking/mapcontrolling your opponents.

In the old TT there was somewhat a meta that was quite flexible, the new one is more micro team comp stop based.

In the old TT there was a jungler and two solo laners. Or some ran 1 top 2 bot.Either way it was Macro based, but with a lot more micro on each person's behalf and possibly more teamwork and ingenuity than a 5s team because of how much more team reliant, counter reliant, and play reliant a 3v3 game is. 2 people melt to 3 people faster than 4 people, melt to 5 people. 3 people vs 3 people is more likely to happen more often than 5 people vs 5 people. Hence the same team feel and map/farm feel, but more push oriented and gank oriented because of team size and map size, and jungle layout.

This map has effectively wronged the old TT players by doing the following:

Halving the map's effective size and hence the jungle size.
They removed top jungle in the same process
-What this does is effectively remove the transition game from being transitioned from bot jungle to top, and more dragon oriented control to bot control. But they also removed the amount of farm from the jungler as well as the purpose for controlling top buffs and jungle.
They added Altars to replace the top jungle buffs
(y'know the old objectives)
-So now we have to capture mundane points by standing on them for a period of time and they give an OP buff (these will also encourage and push the Bruiser meta when coupled with the next issue) instead of the risk of fighting a buff that is timed in a particular NEUTRAL place and that we get those, and otherwise we push together. The game is very much about getting the Altars and it really detracts from the main goal. You know, killing that Nexus thing.

Anyways I really hope this game mode the best, but if it replaces the old TT I will be really disappointed to the point of not playing for a while. ATM me and my buddies only play TT because we cannot all 3 man ranked and we find 5v5 unbearable in the state of the games we play.

Good Luck RIOT, I do sure hope you come to your senses and do not totally remove TT from the game for this.

FearAzrael 10-18-2012 02:52 PM

"Anyone trying to say this "new" TT is a remake with preserving the old one in mind never played the original. "

That's a bold statement.

Nefar1ous 10-18-2012 02:56 PM

100% agree, all im seeing today is things that they are changing that i dont want. Alter's are the lamest thing that's been introduced to this game, and reducing the size is just dumb.

fefddfef 10-18-2012 03:15 PM

I agree, the change is size is drastic and the walls shouldn't have been made so wide. Additionally the top jungle shouldn't have been removed, was a bad call IMHO.

Slowder 10-18-2012 03:19 PM

I think they should just add it as a map and not remove the first one. :(

CaptainAMorgan 10-18-2012 03:24 PM


Originally Posted by Slowder (Hozzászólás 30385616)
I think they should just add it as a map and not remove the first one. :(

That is all I would accept with this map.

67chrome 10-18-2012 03:31 PM

From playing it 4 times all the changes don't make it feel all that different.

It seems a little more spacious with the changes to the jungles and walls, you don't have to zig-zag through mazes and obnoxiously placed barriers as much. There is still a pretty solid number of jungle creeps, at least early on. The graphics update to all of them is pretty swanky to.

The altar control is locked out for 90 seconds after they are captured as well, so they don't feel to distracting to the whole blow up the Nexus thing. They are pretty important though. It still has the same team-oriented feel, with the same capacity for one team to snowball out of control.

Overall the map is really pretty nice, only thing I really don't like is that Wards are unavailable.

CountMoriarty 10-18-2012 03:51 PM

What if Alters had some sort of defense, like mobs or towers, like a normal buff camp would? Or the lock out timer was longer would that fix it?

Also I haven't played new 3v3 Shadow Isle, but I'm not understanding the part about half the jungle. The new jungle allows the jungler to pressure both top and bot at the same time, and each side still has 3 camps on their side, didn't they just remove red?


Would these fixes make it okay?

CaptainAMorgan 10-18-2012 06:47 PM

TT gameplay is based on the same precepts that SR is. It is a similar gameplay based on more macro oriented teamplay, but since the map is smaller and there are smaller avenues more team fighting is inevitable not forced.

The jungle in old TT was super important, but so inconsistent and strong that it was not even looked at by most.

There was game time transition rather than all the action at one point, boss at another gogogogogo.
On the old TT there was a transition in control and relevance (the bots were not totally OP as well. So skipping them for a push was actually worth it Towers were far superior to Drag). Bot is the split push lane, top was the gank roamer with jungler, and top lane was important around the buff time and then Dragon. Dragon was the fight every 5 minutes, compared to 90 seconds that this completely forces. The pacing is completely off.

This map is encouraging very specific fight points, which are far more limiting to the gameplay in comparison to the old TT.
The gameplay in the previous encouraged and enforced more warding (map control), care (longer death timers, creating more careful gameplay as the timer went up), jungling, and overall understanding of the game and map.

Now we are told where to fight and when to fight. On top of this they have dictated the champ selection with their benefits and the speed buff. A speed buff straight from dominion, a cap point straight from dominion, and now unique items just like dominion, and did I mention no wards?

This game mode has been PUSHED from it's original iteration into a complete Dominion Rift 3v3.
Nothing more.

I would be appalled if they pulled TT when they release this.
All TT needed was: Jungle fix, Backdoor fix, Base pull fix, Lane creep balancing, tower fix, and some map redesing (making only particular clear points on the walls that can be jumped, as well as fewer condensed brushes, and a real timeable jungle).

Thine Dude 10-18-2012 06:48 PM

Keep the old twisted treeline!

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