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-   -   Transitioning to PvP (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2637486)

Kazmahu 10-03-2012 10:55 PM

Transitioning to PvP
(I think this is in the right place. Someone tell me if it's not and I'll fix it.)

I've been playing Classic games versus bots for... longer than I should probably admit now, and I have a general grasp of LoL's general mechanics, so I'm keen to make the dive into PvP. I know there's a whole, very complex metagame I'll probably only learn by trying and getting yelled at when I fail, but are there any particularly vital things I should know so I won't embarrass my team too badly? I've had a look around, but I couldn't find any general advice for not being a total disgrace your first time against human opponents, so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Dartaran 10-04-2012 04:43 AM

I'm in the same boat as you are, Kaz. It took me awhile to get "comfortable" with the game, so I started with bots and got used to them. I'm still trying to ween myself off of them. I wanted to learn PvP, so the best advice I can give you is to just do it.

Human players are more creative than bots, so it's trickier to hit skills shots since they may make more cuts/fakes. They will do things like hide in the bushes by the river before minions spawn in the hopes of an early first blood or counter jungle and try to steal a buff/kill the jungler when weak.

Also, they're far more aggressive, such as the hiding in the bushes early example or harassing you in the hopes of getting you to recall earlier.

In general, people will rage over the smallest things sometimes. You have to develop a thicker skin and just ignore the random criticism and take the constructive criticism when you can.

Other than that, try to talk with your team about what roles are needed and TRY to get familiar with at least two champions for each role just in case.

Hope that helps and good luck to you!

Inipro Montoya 10-04-2012 05:09 AM

Oh wow, if you've only played against bots for 17 levels, you're gonna have a really rough time adjusting to pvp. Thats not to say it can't be done, but it won't be easy.

I'd be willing to help you out. While I'm not an expert 2000+ elo guy, I know how the game works. We could do a couple games over skype and I could teach you whats good to do and whats not.

Kazmahu 10-04-2012 05:24 AM

I know I spent WAY too much time in practise, but a few very early attempts at medium bots saw me getting massacred and spooked me for a long time. Complacent Gaming Syndrome at its finest, but I'm willing to try and relearn whatever I have to.

I would appreciate the mentoring, but working out a time might be trick since I'm in a pretty strange timezone for the servers I play on.

Hirumonogatari 10-04-2012 06:16 AM

my suggestion is to NOT go into pvp unless you can get something like a 3:1 K/D ratio in intermediate bots.

i don't know how comfortable you are with your grasp of mechanics, but i sometimes see those 7/8/2 players when playing intermediate and i know they will not survive at all against real players.

Datah 10-04-2012 06:42 AM

Bots are not similar to players in any way. They're infinitely worse at the game, obviously, but intermediate bots are actually better than most players at some things. They have instant reactions, they get items automatically (they always "get farmed" if the game goes long enough), they aim skillshots perfectly (though it is possible to dodge them anyway because of travel time and bots not predicting motion, obviously).

So just jump into PvP. It's a lot more interesting and fun, but at the same time you will find it easier in some ways. If you win your lane and deny the other team farm in a PvP game, you snowball much harder than by getting a few kills in a bot game, because they really will be down farm (bots get gold automatically). Your opponents will make mechanical mistakes and not react very quickly sometimes. At the same time, you will do that too, and lose sometimes because of it.

You will also find much better teammates than you do in bot games. And you will learn from them. You will learn from opponents who beat you. You will start learning from everything (as with all else in life, but people teach you a lot more than bots can!)

Playing against bots, you will only improve at beating bots. They do not think. They behave the same way all the time and by playing against them you are implicitly learning only to take advantage of imperfections in their algorithmic approach to the game.

Players think. They will do things you won't expect. They will surprise you and take advantage of mistakes you didn't even know you were making (and teach you to invent your own tricks to take advantage of mistakes they didn't even know they were making). At the same time, they will make those mistakes themselves. They will build ineffectively. They will fall victim to your own tactics. They will miss skillshots, they will not react quickly, they will fail to farm and fall off hard because of that. They will fail to coordinate, they will initiate badly, they will put themselves in bad positions. You can learn from every aspect of this: from being completely outplayed, to outplaying completely, you will recognize things to optimize about your gameplay, mistakes that can be taken advantage of, and what sorts of decisions have what sorts of consequences.

All of these things are what make the game fun and allow you to improve against real, thinking opponents. So just start playing! It doesn't matter if you lose a hundred games in a row (you will not) or "embarrass" your team sometimes. Everyone has bad games, everyone loses games all the time. Just play, start figuring things out, improve and have fun.

Hirumonogatari 10-04-2012 08:21 AM

sorry datah, i would agree with you on almost all points but one.

people are not nicer in pvp games. if you do badly for whatever reason, you WILL get toxic flaming. i would rather he practice to a decent level to avoid the worst of it than be discouraged from the game after a few consecutive toxic games.

iDpark 10-04-2012 09:55 AM

I played bots for a long time. I started PvP at like lv20, or something similar. I actually found intermediate bots harder, cause they get super fed. I've lost a couple bot games. I actually started PvP when I felt like bots weren't a challenge.

PvP isn't too bad, just try it out. Just be polite even when others aren't and hopefully, with this Honor System, it'll be better.

There are too many tip to give for me to type them, but just a couple.

Buy Wards, Call MIAs, and save lives.
Don't be afraid to lose a game, unless it's Ranked.
Do not feed kills, at all costs. What you do when you die, is you deny yourself farm, and you feed the other person even more farm.
Counterbuild your lane opponent. Build a frozen heart or Randumins versus AD champions, rush a negatron cloak + merc Treads against AP, build hp, and play tankier champs. Squishies don't have as much leeway to make a mistake.
Play mundo, and ignore people who rage. Dyrus (pro player) does it.

Everything comes with experience.

Kazmahu 10-04-2012 11:15 PM

Thanks for the advice, everyone! I ended up just taking the plunge and trying an unranked blind pick. Could not have asked for more graceful opponents (though my team... ehh, sure that much telling people to kill themselves is an aberration). I'm sure team composition would have given any ranked player nightmares, but I managed to contribute with a Morgana build I had written down and playing against humans was certainly much more engaging. And I learned for certain what iDpark said is true, wards and MIAs can save lives.

Thanks again for the advice, everyone!

Ramachese 10-05-2012 10:54 AM

I generally use bots as a way to get my head around a new character I want to try. I'll run a couple beginner, a couple intermediates then take him to PvP. I don't like it when people in PvP have the disclaimer 'this is my first time with x'. Get the basics of the character and position then come to PvP.

I should note that I am not some spectacular player or anything - haven't even reach 30 yet. I just see it as good sense to learn a new character with bots before wading into the deep end.

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