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Mirage91 09-15-2012 01:31 PM

Ranked Help
 
Okay so i guess im not hot **** at this game and dropping from 1390 elo to unseen elo suxs hard and i ask for you help/tips. I have read guides on characters, zoning, warding so i'll try to be more specific.

Idk if you can see my games but i did bad as ADC kog bot (i usually can match cs tho)
1. Teamfighting? so i read that just hitting whatever is in your range even if it is teh tank, and if you are able obviously hit the burster/ADC safely...is that what i should be doing?

2. Possibly a jungle issue but I ALWAYS never push my lane because i hate jungle ganks and usually never push past the first bush. Certain matches im nearly at my tower asking for ganks and never happens...should i be expecting ganks from my jungler or is it just me and my support trying to do what we can?

3. Eventhough bot is warded plz gank. Is that wrong? support is not able to clear it with a vision ward all the time but even if our jungler came down scaring bot would help me cs a little.

4. After bot carry is killed jungle and bot go dragon then enemy comes....do we just leave? or try and kill dragon because it is worth much more?

5. If enemy support has oracle in a teamfight assuming all are in range who am i prioritizing?

In high level games i have seen kills are under 10 or so by 20mins and it feels very different....wards galore mostly ive learned that just dont die goes a long way

srry i can't tl:dr all that but any advice is much appreciated.

Essieu 09-15-2012 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
1. Teamfighting? so i read that just hitting whatever is in your range even if it is teh tank, and if you are able obviously hit the burster/ADC safely...is that what i should be doing?

Hit whatever is Squishiest/Scariest and that you are able to hit without putting yourself out of position. (In Danger of CC, dying, etc.)

2. Possibly a jungle issue but I ALWAYS never push my lane because i hate jungle ganks and usually never push past the first bush. Certain matches im nearly at my tower asking for ganks and never happens...should i be expecting ganks from my jungler or is it just me and my support trying to do what we can?

In Bottom lane most of the time pushing your lane is the only way your going to get ganks. Normally river/tribush is warded but the lane bushes arent. So By pushing your lane you can have your jungler come through the bush in lane. Its not necessarily NEVER PUSH, or ALWAYS PUSH. But learn lane control, how to force their lane into positions where you have the advantage.

3. Eventhough bot is warded plz gank. Is that wrong? support is not able to clear it with a vision ward all the time but even if our jungler came down scaring bot would help me cs a little.

If you cant at least keep up in lane without a junglers help. Your doing bad. You should time ganks around the times that it isnt warded. So Everytime you see a ward go down, ping it, say "ward, gone at xx:xx time" (wards last 3 minutes if you didnt know) The reason I say this, is because if he comes just so you can CS better, he's wasting his time.

4. After bot carry is killed jungle and bot go dragon then enemy comes....do we just leave? or try and kill dragon because it is worth much more?

The only time you should go for dragon is in one of 3 scenarios.
1. You can do dragon and the enemy team cant contest.
2.You can tank dragon and then still fight the enemy team.
3.You can start dragon and when the enemy shows up you can peel off dragon and initiate a fight on the enemies that show up.


5. If enemy support has oracle in a teamfight assuming all are in range who am i prioritizing?

Dont get caught up in this, keep yourself alive, kill it if you can, but its more like a bonus than a necessity.

I main AD 1590 elo.

Mirage91 09-15-2012 02:34 PM

thx for replying
question 3 was kinda tied with question 2 because to me it seems like a perfect opportunity to gank and if i told him there was a ward there he can still just run all the way through and potentially catch someone.

As for pushing/lane control i have seen those ganks happen but if i want my jungler to try doing something like hiding at the tribush or going in bot bush while vision is down i hear "stop pushing so hard noob" recently i asked for a bot gank and he said "hold on i need wriggles first" wtf does that have to do with anything?

FaerellG 09-16-2012 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
Idk if you can see my games but i did bad as ADC kog bot (i usually can match cs tho)

Got LoLReplay? I recommend it.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
1. Teamfighting? so i read that just hitting whatever is in your range even if it is teh tank, and if you are able obviously hit the burster/ADC safely...is that what i should be doing?

You got the right idea. Additionally, you might also consider when it's possible for you to dive past their tank and go for a squishy target. My AD carry of choice is Sivir, so she has that spell shield. If I know the tank only has 1 disruption spell left, then I'll walk up and be ready to block whatever CC they'll throw my way. With my super speed from my ulti and passive, I can get in and out very quickly. But that's a very Sivir specific tactic. Other AD carries have their own tricks to play, so you might want to look into those situations and what you can do to gain a greater edge in the fight.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
2. Possibly a jungle issue but I ALWAYS never push my lane because i hate jungle ganks and usually never push past the first bush. Certain matches im nearly at my tower asking for ganks and never happens...should i be expecting ganks from my jungler or is it just me and my support trying to do what we can?

Yes and No. Yes, it's a good practice to try to freeze the lane just outside of your tower's range. That is optimal farming strategy, it's also a very "passive" strategy. There are aggressive lanes as well, this mostly depends on the AD/Support combo. For example, Soraka is a very passive support. She generally sits back and heals/infuses, but she does have some poke. It's not the best, so it's not going to scare anyone off.
On the other hand, Leona is a very aggressive support. No heals, just lots of CC and extra damage.

Then you have ADs who can be passive or aggressive depending on the matchup and lane. So for example, a Sivir/Taric combo is very aggressive. Taric stuns and Sivir BBs for some easy nuke damage. Repeat it once or twice, and you have dead opponent.

on the other hand, you could have Soraka/Vayne. Vayne is very passive early game because her early game is weak. Low range, and low damage output, but she gets really strong late game, so your goal is to out farm and stay alive.

So that being said, you need to consider the lane match up as to when you can push out. Additionally, you need to keep track of the jungler and have the jungler's gank paths warded and you need to know your retreat potential. How far can you go and still be safe with your wards?

You can easily push out and be safe if you have wards in the right spot. You can also push out and be aggressive when you know the jungler is elsewhere. Jungler just show his face in top lane? Time to push. You got a good minute or so before the jungler is even within range to be considered a threat (unless it's a jungle shen which is why Shen is banned so frequently).

But yeah, there's a lot of things to consider. In short, if you have the advantage and it's safe, you should push out and force them to farm under their tower where they're likely to miss last hits.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
3. Eventhough bot is warded plz gank. Is that wrong? support is not able to clear it with a vision ward all the time but even if our jungler came down scaring bot would help me cs a little.

That would depend on your intentions. Yes he can show his face to scare bot, but if your opponents are smart, that gives their top some relief. Remember how I said, when you see the jungler in top, you got about a minute to push if you like? Same thing applies if the top lane sees the jungler in bot. Push if you have the advantage.

Aside from that, you can try a lane gank. if you push out a bit, your jungler can sneak into the lane bush and hide there. They'll likely just push right back into your jungler and it's an easy 3v2.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
4. After bot carry is killed jungle and bot go dragon then enemy comes....do we just leave? or try and kill dragon because it is worth much more?

Who shows up? Can you fight them and win? Dragon shells out about 1000 gold for your team. Will kills/assists that you give up come up to 1000 for their team? There's also opportunity cost in that when you're dead, you can't be farming a lane and that's lost CS too. Or, you might lose a tower.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
5. If enemy support has oracle in a teamfight assuming all are in range who am i prioritizing?

Win the fight first. Target threats (damage dealers) first. Worry about winning the fight, then worry about dropping the oracles. No sense in killing the support if it means your team gets aced by their damage dealers.
Also, supports are generally good at staying alive too.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirage91 (Hozzászólás 29290096)
In high level games i have seen kills are under 10 or so by 20mins and it feels very different....wards galore mostly ive learned that just dont die goes a long way

Pros play very different than we do. High Elo plays much like pros, but as you go down, it starts being very different. Something I always say to people who complain about "Elo hell" is that high level tactics don't work at low level play.

For example, I was jungling and decided to counterjungle. I usually picked good invade paths and calculated risks, but my lane never really came to help even though they were near by. As a result I ended up dying alot despite pings and warning my lanes that I was going to invade the jungle. Moral of the story? That group of friends plays at about a 1200 level, I cannot rely on them to back me up when I invade, therefor I shouldn't counter jungle aggressively when playing at their level.

Similar things occur in other lanes as well. Sometimes, at the lower Elo, you just can't rely on people to land their abilities...or dodge opposing skill shots. You have to go into every game fresh and be prepared to take advantage of a teammate's surprisingly skilled play, or be prepared to make up for a teammate's lack of skill. You need to be flexible and adaptable to your team. If you're playing AD, you may expect a teammate to land their stuns and roots to keep you safe, but they might not be that good, you gotta make up for it with better positioning.


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