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-   -   Why Twisted Treeline is a Joke (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1742976)

Swiftcarp 01-23-2012 12:26 PM

@Riot: Twisted Treeline Has Problems (Now with solutions!)
 
5 Attachment(s)
Edit 17:ERMERGERD http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2689472

Well, let's see how this plays out. This will either be a glorious day or a rather upsetting one.

Reminder: this is not to discuss the validity of various champions. Champions should be and will be balanced around 5v5s. Keep this thread on the topic of flaws TT has that can be fixed without affecting other elements of the game.

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# of Red responses on the first page of the Summoner's Rift section of the forums: 3

# of Red responses in all of the Twisted Treeline section of the forums: 3


# of Red responses in this random thread about Viktor (http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=1755346) within 3 minutes: 4

As a TT player, I'm not terribly appalled by this usually. I understand that the game is balanced around 5v5s and I'll accept that. I'm ok with singed being Top-tier all the time, I won't ask for nerfs when he's virtually unseen in SR right now. That doesn't mean that TT doesn't have fundamental problems, however. We need answers, a timeline, a sign that you're still watching, anything: we just need a real response, Riot.

From what I understand, since the jungle changes to SR, all of the monsters in the jungle of TT are substantially harder, limiting the variety of junglers down to a select few. Then, when you do jungle, there's a heavy reliance on variance. If, by luck of the draw, you get a wraith camp instead of a mixed camp, you're now level 1 still while their jungler is level 2 and can (usually) gank at that point with relative ease. In addition, wolf buff camp is also noticeably harder to obtain, overall making jungling a hassle and not easily accessible as Riot stated it would be in the patch preview where they mentioned the jungle changes. All we ask is that the jungle not be randomized, some troublesome camps (Double golems, for example) be slightly easier for mana users to be viable in the jungle, and perhaps dragon is a little less easy to obtain, seeing as most people can solo it with a wriggles at level 6 in about 10 seconds, given decent wriggles procs.

Another huge problem to my understanding is the fact that minions (and enemy champions if champions on your team have that ability) in a player's base are easily pulled into the turret fountain due to the location of the nexus turret and the ridiculous range of the fountain turret. Champions with decent ranges can stand under the protection of the fountain turret and defend the nexus turret while champions without range are powerless to combat them, making melee champions rather underwhelming when it comes to actually winning the game. One solution to this would be to swap the nexus turret and the nexus, letting minions spawn in between the 2 closer to the walls than the fountain. This prevents most champions from hugging the fountain turret while being able to protect their base. Another solution would be to shorten the range of the fountain turret.

Lastly, Summoner's Rift, after an outcry of players called for a normal draft mode, received just that. However, on a map like Twisted Treeline, which the game is not balanced around, having a ban system is almost imperative. Yet TT has no such mode. An argument against implementing such a mode would be that it would divide the already small TT community, making queue times ridiculously long. However, that fails to accommodate for the players that would gain interest in TT after draft mode would be installed, which is a surprisingly large number. It's really disheartening how dominion has a draft mode, but good old TT doesn't.

All of these problems are easily fixable without disrupting a single thing on SR.

I know and reiterate that SR will always take priority over TT. But TT is a published work from Riot that they still have a obligation to attend to from time to time. Most TT players are patient and willing to cooperate, but we'd like answers.

Riot, with TT having apparent fundamental flaws, what are your intentions with TT?

TL;DR: Problems with TT, read the bold/underlined, need a Riot response, please bump.

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Edit: 61 upvotes in about 3 hours. Let's keep it going guys.

Edit2: I come back the next day to almost 150 upvotes, many bumps not from myself, and players who are passionate about getting these changes in. I'm proud of you guys. Even though we got moved to the TT forums, we can still make a difference. Tell your friends, keep making threads, disguise titles in general chat and then copy-paste this, if need be. I don't mind

Edit3: Added Illusia bait. And, you know, if anyone else wants cookies, there's always more.

Edit4: http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...php?p=20171258 Don't bother bumping anymore. It got moved. However, feel free to make threads like this in general chat linking to this thread.

Edit5: 200+ upvotes. Simply amazing.

Edit6: More cookies. That's pretty significant. And, you know, also having 18 pages of bumps and 360 upvotes. That's pretty big too I guess.

Edit8: 500 upvotes. Utterly astonishing. Almost as great as these moist, warm, delicious cookies I'm putting in.

Edit9: Not only are we at nearly 700 upvotes and 33 pages, but we also got a red to post in the TT forums recently (haven't had the time to actually check recently. A similar thread in General discussion also got Riot posts about TT as well. http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...1#post20756331 /// http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/...57046#20557046 One heart shaped cookie to celebrate such an occasion

Edit 10: In the Fiora patch preview, there were changes to sigils in SR that made it so that mana was refunded. Why can't TT get this same love? Sigils would make it so that at least the variance in the jungle wouldn't be completely crippling. Just slightly. Keep pressing Riot for answers, please!

Edit11: Yet another patch with no changes. Almost 2 months now with nothing more than a single red post saying "we haven't forgotten" about 2 months ago. Keep pressing Riot guys. Email, create threads, bump this one; all that fun jazz.

Edit 12: Hey, look. It's April first. Riot is surely joking when they didn't even acknowledge TT in their joke video, right? Whatever, though. We shall overcome, someday. Keep linking to this thread, pressing Riot for responses, etc. Bunny Riven was made because of enough popularity and time, and that's just cosmetics that take even more time, so we can get TT back to being a viable mode.

Edit 13: Wow. 1k upvotes, 46 pages. 1,000 cookies to celebrate! Let's get to 2k, and more importantly, let's get some answers. They're pretty long over due.

Edit 14: Just letting you all know I'm not dead. At least Riot Taco Storm is posting more in the TT forums. Wish he'd comment something about this thread, but I'll take what we can get.

Edit 15: http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/....php?t=2217715

Edit 16: It's been half a year today since this thread was created. 58 pages, 1350 upvotes, countless emails, and hopefully unyielding support thus far. All we can do is continue onward.

RiotNome is best Red poster.

Swiftcarp 01-23-2012 12:28 PM

Please bump if you care about Riot and their quality work, but them also maintaining it.

Aidan M xD 01-23-2012 12:30 PM

I agree, Riot treat it like it's like the ginger son Riot just wishes it had worn a condom to prevent.

Aametherar 01-23-2012 12:30 PM

Bump cause your favorite map sucks.

Enemy Minion 01-23-2012 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swiftcarp (Hozzászólás 20088707)
I understand that the game is balanced around 5v5s

Except Dr. Mundo.

ಠ_ಠ

SavageMinnow 01-23-2012 12:32 PM

I sometimes play TT, but the terrible lack of balance means I'm virtually guaranteed to see Singed, Trynd, Shaco, and the like in every single blind pick. I could play ranked to avoid that (there's no norm draft, sigh,) but I don't have a team that gives any ****s about TT.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ţepper (Hozzászólás 20088896)
Except Dr. Mundo.

ಠ_ಠ

I used to really love playing Mundo, too. Back then he was somewhat viable on SR, with only the occasional derp complaint that he had too much survivability.

FireitUp622 01-23-2012 12:33 PM

if they don't balance around it and don't plan to do anything with it (they don't), why would you expect them to dedicate resources to it?

Swiftcarp 01-23-2012 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SavageMinnow (Hozzászólás 20088902)
I sometimes play TT, but the terrible lack of balance means I'm virtually guaranteed to see Singed, Trynd, Shaco, and the like in every single blind pick. I could play ranked to avoid that (there's no norm draft, sigh,) but I don't have a team that gives any ****s about TT.

Normal draft! I forgot about that. Thank you.


Quote:

Originally Posted by FireitUp622 (Hozzászólás 20088927)
if they don't balance around it and don't plan to do anything with it (they don't), why would you expect them to dedicate resources to it?

Look, I'm not a programmer or a game designer, so I may be way off base, but surely it can't take that much effort to change a few numbers and test it. They could probably even forgo testing, throw out some numbers that make sense, and TT players would still be happy that there are patch notes about their map.

tangosmango 01-23-2012 12:34 PM

the only reason TT is around is so riot can use it as an excuse for the delay of mundo remake (not the 2-3 minor buffs he recently received)

SP3 01-23-2012 12:36 PM

You want them to answer who, if no one plays TT?


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