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-   -   The Idea of a Tank-Killer (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=922985)

axesandspears 07-04-2011 02:01 PM

The Idea of a Tank-Killer
 
I'm going to keep this short and simple.

-Any champion that kills tanks fast will also kill dps fast.
&
-Tanks need to be able to survive large bursts to do their job.

Therefore: Tank-killers would virtually remove the effectiveness of tanking and serve as carries that could kill everything else quickly, turning this into a carry-only game in a short amount of time.

I understand tanks need to be killable, but it needs to be hard to kill them, currently, the difference between true tanks and dps is about right (vayne might be a bit much though) and no new champion should be designed purely with killing tanks in mind.

Thank you for reading and commenting below.

Giltia Zero 07-04-2011 02:06 PM

Pretty much spot on here.

Tanks survive longer because they build a tonne of mitigation. Any character built to kill people with defence quickly will simply kill people without defence even faster.

Which is why max health % based true damage is the dumbest thing I have ever heard.

Vayne's not OP, but that doesn't make the concept a good idea.

Valkyrea 07-04-2011 02:09 PM

but i could turn this same argument around then, if tank killers are a bad idea and tanks are are supposed to just cc and soak damage. then tanks should not be able to do large bursts of damage, ex.amumu's ult, etc etc. so if you want tanks to be tanks then lower their damage output so they're fair also.

Giltia Zero 07-04-2011 02:14 PM

Amumu is actually very squishy as far as tanks go. Generally speaking, tanks build very little damage, and recieve a token amount to generate threat to SQUISHIES. Champs who build defense rarely have anything to worry about from tanks.

Drnmage 07-04-2011 02:45 PM

it's really not that hard of a concept to grasp. dunno about you but i'm sick of playing carries and watching a char like jarvan go completely full tank, and throw the punishment on me and my other team's carries. in the same way that veigar hits harder the more ap an opposing team's champ has, you could make it so that a new champions abilities could increase with the more armor and/or magic resistance an opposing champ has. obviously you wouldn't make it so this champ blows up an enemy tank as fast as carries can blow up other carries, but there has to be some repercussions if a team decides to go almost pure tank, because there's no way a team like that should be able to win a game.

Chatastrophe 07-04-2011 02:52 PM

Actually, the best idea of a tank killer is to do damage based on resistences. I'm sure this sounds overpowered at first, but it could actually work, dealing more damage the more resistence they have, and very little to squishies.

Rindon Calsar 07-04-2011 02:52 PM

Tanks and tanky dps just need to have their base dmg on skill nerfed hard and increase the ratios. This would make them either have to build and play like a tank, or build and play like a dps. At the moment most tanky dps is kind of ridiculous. Semi-tanky Jarvan rolling through an entire team shouldn't be able to happen but it does.

Daen 07-04-2011 02:56 PM

As Valkyrea said, if you expect tanks to be able to shoulder a lot of the brunt of an assault, they need to do less damage. Champions like Alistar and Blitzcrank don't actually have to build that tankily to be effective in the role, but they can basically carry their teams with how much damage they put out.

~Eagle~

WCsharp 07-04-2011 03:01 PM

The problem imo is true damage, in theory it's great, tanks build resistance thus true damage. However you're left with no way to counter it, thus the only people resistant to that damage are health tanks, so in making a tank assassin you've simply made an assassin who can kill tanks.

If there were a way to say, if enemy target has +3000 health they receive the damage as true damage and if they have less they receive it as magic damage it would be ok (though convoluted).

That said though aren't carries/mages both counters to tanks? tanks don't have the damage to outright kill carriers shy of attrition and typically don't have a way to fight against kiting. Amumu sure, but a simple side step solves that problem, alistar not really since he still has to cover the same distance (unless he hits you into a wall). Shen's taunt has good range however Ashe's arrow has more. Etc Etc.

Lukrezia 07-04-2011 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by axesandspears (Hozzászólás 10880348)
I'm going to keep this short and simple.

-Any champion that kills tanks fast will also kill dps fast.
&
-Tanks need to be able to survive large bursts to do their job.

Therefore: Tank-killers would virtually remove the effectiveness of tanking and serve as carries that could kill everything else quickly, turning this into a carry-only game in a short amount of time.

I understand tanks need to be killable, but it needs to be hard to kill them, currently, the difference between true tanks and dps is about right (vayne might be a bit much though) and no new champion should be designed purely with killing tanks in mind.

Thank you for reading and commenting below.

You make it sound like any carry can do it lol. Tank killers ~specialise~ in killing tanks because they do it better than other champions. Naturally % damage works just as effectively on lower health champs because it is % damage. But not every champ accesses % damage spells/items and as a result are better suited to avoiding tanks unless absolutely necessary. Vayne and kog'maw for example do proportional damage to both tanks and other champs, but nonetheless the fact that damage they can deal is based on a % of health, they are better suited compared to say an ashe with a crit sort of build.


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