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-   -   An Alternative to Leavers (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=757239)

Orphan Harvest 05-18-2011 11:46 AM

An Alternative to Leavers
2 Attachment(s)
Four games in a row... four games--three of which were ranked games--had someone leave or rage quit a few minutes in.

Below I would like to propose an idea that isn't a solution to leavers, but it may make the situation that they put you in a little less disadvantageous:

The Problem:

Someone has just left your game. It could have been from the first moment or 30 minutes into the game. You are pissed. You seem to be doing fine, but you just can't seem to pull ahead with four players and you are starting to lose ground. Regardless, you probably won't win without your 5th.

The "Solution":

Introduce, as an option, the ability to join a game already in progress. This would be a player decision that they would choose (or not choose) at the queue selection. This person is now a Substitute Summoner (hereafter referred to as SS).

The Whole Picture:

It would be the sole discretion of RIOT (obviously) to decide the method on how this would be detected and/or how long the person would have to be disconnected before permanently locking them out and allowing the SS to take that spot. Obviously, there are a number of reasons that a person may disconnect from a game that does not involve malicious intent, such as:
  • Connection or ISP issues
  • Game client issues
  • Power outtage
  • Connectivity issues specific to PVP.NET
  • An unfortunate event where they had to just leave

The above list would probably prove to be the hardest thing to figure out on when the appropriate time to "let that person go" is. Being reasonable, I think there could at least be some guidelines that the system could check before giving that person "the boot" permanently from that game:
  • If player has X Number of Reconnects = Lock Out
  • If player has been disconnected for X Number of Minutes = Lock Out
  • If player has been AFK for X Number of Minutes = Kick and Lock Out
  • If player has been in X Size Radius for X Number of Minutes = Kick and Lock Out (This would be to keep players from going "AFK" but not receiving the leaver status. Basically moving or hitting space bar a few times every minute or so)
  • If player has not performed an ability or attacked an enemy champion or minion in X Number of minutes = Kick and Lock Out (Another fail-safe for the latter reason)
  • A ratio check on Games Player to Games Left. If the player has a higher than average ratio of games left, the system will be more inclined to kick and lock out earlier.

The Inner-Workings:

This would be an opt-in feature. I believe that making this an option that you can tick and un-tick would be too difficult to program in. Mainly because:

1) Going into the settings to tick and un-tick this setting every time you wanted disable or enable the option is a repetitive and eventually annoying step.

2) Because of how quickly full games are found due to RIOT's player-base (average of ~28 seconds), I would guess that if you had the option enabled and built into a normal queue, the frequency in which you would find an game in progress may be slim.

I suggest that it is added to the Queue options after hitting play. That you have to make a conscious decision to either queue for a new game, or for one in progress. When a game is found, the SS is presented with a prompt like the (poor) example attached to this thread (labeled lol.png). You are given 1.5 minutes (Edit: Time reduced because of new Mastery Pages) to decide in case you would like to re-spec your Summoner rune pages and masteries.

If you are the adventurous type, you can join the game blindly from the first prompt. Doing this, you are thrown into the game without changing your rune pages or masteries. The only information you get to see is what is on that prompt: Your team, their team and the score. You don't find out what champion you are playing until you hit the loading screen!

If you decide you would like to know more, you can hit the "View Details" button and you will receive one last prompt. It could look something like in the second attachment below (labeled lol2.png). From this screen you can see the champion you are playing, the gold you have, the game time, the K/D/A you are going to start at, what items you have and your current level.

EDIT: I forgot to include this, but I would have the Summoner Spells shown since you probably wouldn't be able to change those while entering a game in progress.

If you are not interested, skip it! If you are ready to go and don't need anything changed, go ahead and hit that Join Button! Want to join, but you need to re-spec? The middle option will allow you to change your masteries and rune pages during the amount of time you have remaining. Again, when this prompt pops up, you have 1.5 minutes (Edit: Time reduced because of Mastery Pages) to go through everything. This gives plenty of time to read over the game and change runes and masteries if needed.

I know this is a long post and thank you so much if you took the time to read it! I am just thinking of other ways to alleviate this issue. There are days when I have played for hours and was lucky enough to not encounter one person leaving the game. Alternately, I have also been in streaks where there has been someone that left or went AFK for like 4 games in a row... everyone knows it sucks.

I would love to hear any feed-back, constructive criticism, improvements and maybe even a Red response!

Let me know what you think!


,.-~'~-.,.-~'~-.,UPDATE (5/25/2011),.-~'~-.,.-~'~-.,
Gradual XP Gain While Disconnected
Inspired by: NoradIV's Post
RIOT could come up with a formula that granted that AFK/Disconnected champion a gradual gain of XP over time. This gain would only kick in when the leaver is locked out. This prevents the champions from being too far behind in levels while the system finds a suitable SS.

Skip Limit
Inspired by: Valorius's Post
To avoid the abuse of the system by constantly skipping until a match that is in your favor is found, a five (5) skip limit will be put into effect. You cannot skip more than five (5) games in a single queue. On the fifth queue that appears to the SS, they must take it. Once this fifth queue pops, a hidden timer will start that will prevent the SS from queuing in an "in progress game" again for 20 minutes or until the game they are in finishes. This timer will prevent the SS from entering the game and then immediately dodging to queue again. This also adds another layer of protection from having the SS leave as they would not only get that 20 minute lock out from queuing again, but they would also receive leaver status.

Sell Items for Full Price
Inspired by: NoradIV's Post
To alleviate the issue of leavers will "troll builds", the SS entering the game will have 1 minute to be able to sell any items they want for full value. After that one minute mark, the price diminishes to the normal values. The only way I can see the leaver circumnavigating this feature is by selling all of their items for their diminished value before they leave.


Bane Wraith 05-18-2011 01:02 PM

Love it.


Although, in my opinion, this should be no means lessen the penalty placed on leavers. They're still creating a delay, and have still abandoned their team-- as well as made sure the enemy team can't have a truly honest win.

Orphan Harvest 05-18-2011 01:08 PM


Originally Posted by Bane Wraith (Hozzászólás 8984030)
Love it.


Although, in my opinion, this should be no means lessen the penalty placed on leavers. They're still creating a delay, and have still abandoned their team-- as well as made sure the enemy team can't have a truly honest win.

I completely agree. Although, I do think that RIOT could fix up their system a little. I encountered a player yesterday that had 290-ish wins and exactly 117 leaves. That is about 40% of his games are leaves! (disregarding unseen losses). I find that insane that the kid is still allowed to play.

Now if you have 1000 wins and about 100 losses, that is perfectly acceptable. That is 10% of your wins and even more minute if lost games are factored in.

Thanks again for reading my whole post!

Bane Wraith 05-18-2011 01:21 PM


Originally Posted by iBeeZy (Hozzászólás 8984131)
I encountered a player yesterday that had 290-ish wins and exactly 117 leaves. That is about 40% of his games are leaves! (disregarding unseen losses). I find that insane that the kid is still allowed to play.

...I heard a Rumor some time ago that such players are actually playing such old accounts, that this was Before such strict lines were put in place for leaving. Yet it still shows up on their profile. Can't exactly verify if they're true. Or maybe they simply play so Rarely (Or Badly. xD ) that the leaves are spanned over many years? (or losses? xD )

EDIT: I'm trying to support my own thread, -= Here =- ( Feel free to comment. )... regarding bringing Back the option to report players from the Chatrooms on PvP.net. ( effectively reporting all the scammers, spammers and trolls that are present Outside of actual games... ) Is it possible to create a poll once the thread is already made? Oh, and, yes, I hope you're aware this is shameless plugging/getting the word out.

Orphan Harvest 05-18-2011 03:44 PM

Not sure about that rumor. I have a pretty old account that was subjected to a LOT of leaves due to server instability and PVP.NET issues way back when. Stuff that I couldn't control.

I don't think they were counting them back then.

Villiroth 05-18-2011 08:08 PM

That rumor is BS, everything got reset when season 1 started.

Also, I wish people making new threads would use the search function to find older posts about the very thing they are about to talk about. Atleast then they could address some of the issues that have shot down the exact idea several times before.

Lethal stoner 05-19-2011 12:15 AM

tottaly agree on this would be so much better lost alot of fights because a leaver hh

Orphan Harvest 05-19-2011 05:21 AM


Originally Posted by Villiroth (Hozzászólás 8992369)
That rumor is BS, everything got reset when season 1 started.

Also, I wish people making new threads would use the search function to find older posts about the very thing they are about to talk about. Atleast then they could address some of the issues that have shot down the exact idea several times before.

I did do a search; and of the 4 competent threads I found that were actually well thought out and well written, i felt they were inadequate to my suggestion. Instead of "wishing I searched", please contribute some of your own thoughts and ideas! I'm not saying my suggestion is unique, but I fell that I put enough thought and effort into it that we could at least get another thread out there with another idea.

Most of the ideas for leavers are very good (some completely stupid).

If you would like. I can combine (and credit) the other "leaver solutions" into this thread and we can work from there.

Perfect Insanity 05-20-2011 06:42 AM

I like the Idea but I still see a small flaw. Let's say that 10 minutes into a game somebody leaves on the purple team. Then 5 minutes later that person is locked out from the game, then matchmaking que line, about 30 seconds to find the game and 5 minutes for the person in queue to check which champ being used, put runes and masteries, etc. Then the loading and connecting to the game in play can also take it's time depending on each person's individual comps. That can get up to a total of 15 minutes from the purple team player leaving till another comes to take the spot. Add that to the fact that 5 minutes is very less time, I mean I once got bluescreened during a game and 8 minutes of the game passed before I could even start rebooting my pc. 10 minutes in a game can mean alot of levels an money missed. I could dc now, get back in 10 minutes later but be easily 8-9 levels behind the next lowest level in play. Would make me too weakto fight right till I catch up...

The way I'd look at it would be to: include a volunteerly leave function. Basically in the record and your match history this will be categorized as a leave AND a loss. Also upon leave, you're penalized with 10 minutes of wait prior queuing for another game. Like when with champion select you leave and have to wait 5 mins? Same thing, just longer. Additionally the team that loses their member will have that member substituted by a bot of the same champion. This bot shall respond to the ping systemand thus is how it will be commanded by the players. The bot will be basic if the average level of the remaining players on both sides is below 20 for example, and intermediate when it's above.

Disconnects are a hit and miss tho. Only idea I could put here is make the losses forgiven ones if the disconnected player spends 40%+ of the match time without being there. The win will still count for the other team If they win ofc.

Bane Wraith 05-20-2011 07:26 AM

As a response to HeckMayster, the system he's suggesting Really doesn't seem to all that time consuming. In fact, I'm beginning to believe those estimates are grossly exaggerated.

1) There's already a Voluntary leaving system; it's called Quitting. If the system above is implemented, I'd leave it to Riot entirely to determine their penalty. (Perhaps 20 minutes suspension from game playing... ).
2) Bots have a chance of Feeding the opponent, and making the situation a LOT worse than simply an inactive champion. Furthermore, the AI is currently made for only a few champions. This is Not an option for PvP games.
3) The average summoner can already lock in their Masteries, rune page, and champion in anywhere from 15-45 seconds, and have it function with the rest of their team. Here, you don't even need to pick a champ. The average loading speed of a game is typically under a minute, especially for higher end machines. The average Q for a 10-person game is under 30 seconds. Note, however, this is for a Ten Person Game, whereas in the above case you only need One summoner that's in the rough ELO range. Ideally, you're in the game 2 minutes after a summoner is declared 'gone'. Even beyond ideals, it will probably take at most 5 minutes.
4) iBeeZy is already suggesting a Malleable template to determine and confirm when a player is 'gone' from a game. This template Does suggest waiting some time after a player disconnects, and, yes, it's debatable as to exactly how long that should be. But try to look at it this way:

-- If the timer is set to around 5 minutes, then a replacement player still in the game after about 7 minutes of inactivity. 5 minutes (hell, even shorter) is More than enough, since the slot can be filled the moment a summoner is "summoning" (rather than once they Finnish loading), and an average Recoverable DC (blink in the internet, client crash) doesn't take more than a few minutes to resolve. If you're having a power outage, and/or your entire freaking system just locked up, Chances are your teammates are Not going to miss you, or want to see you if you're coming back over 10 minutes later =P.
--- No matter How the timer is set (There Should be a timer, however, to make sure those premades can get back up and running... ), the Disconnecting player still only suffers a set time penalty-- which, by all chances, is probably already going to be 30-60% done with by the time they get back in after a serious bluescreen.
--- You can always suggest another feature, like "Vote to hold slot open", for those premades.

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