need sion help.
Alrighty i have been playing ap sion for a while now and i figured i would come here and ask for a few tips.. here is how a build my sion.
Abilities i build are
ya i pretty much max my stun after my ultimate.. then my shield.. then my enrage.
as far as gear goes i lead with saphire crystal and 2 health pots.
then build normal boots..
then i build sheen..
then sorc boots..
then i build soulstealer.. then lichbane.. then ring..
i just try to lane and manage my mana.. get lucky stuns and ganks... i go sparingly on shield creep farming and just single target them down..
as for runs i run armor pen runes in my red slots.. ability point runes in my yellow slots.. and mana regen runes for my blue slots..
all this sound right? got any tips.. anything really im just looking to get better.
Max shield first. It pulls triple duty as protection, big threat to enemy heroes, and a big money maker.
Stun vs. Axe is up to you, I like maxing axe first because the extra hp from all the creep kills that I easily get from exploding my shield (you can tap the button again after 4s to detonate it on command) usually gives me an extra 100-250 life over the course of the game. That said, the stun is great damage, just huge mana cost and short range.
My only insight (beside the "go search for the 5 AP sion threads in the past few days") is that shield is *the* core ability for AP sion =P
I agree, you should max shield, then stun, then enrage last.
Also why do you have amror pen instead of magic pen?
He's my go-to champ. when the team just needs either a tank or something that has good DD output, pushing ability and CC.
First off, AP Sion is the only way to play him right now due to how his abilities synergize with Sheen and his AP ratios. PD Sion is alright, but there simply better choices out there for that build/job, albeit potentially incremental.
I'm glad you've already got some experience with AP Sion, but you need to properly know what to anticipate throughout the game phases.
Depending on your opposition, he's awesome at early game ganking, and there's a slight early game build change for that I will touch on if you're interested.
Mini-AP Sion road manual:
Go Ability Power, Magic Pen., CD reduction all mana regen. (this helps your early laning power, helping you farm enough to come back with real boots and a good item), or all Scaling Health.
I put these in order of preference for my AP Sion, and kept them somewhat generalized due to fact that most people just don't have a a ton of runes yet.
Offensive:Savvy, Cripple/1 in Dealiness, Sorcery, Archaic Knowledge.
This is the only useful thing in the off. tree for AP Sion.
Defensive:You can dabble in this if you want, but it's generally a better idea to look more at our next tree.
Utility: Perseverance, Expanded Mind (Sion needs the mana), Meditation, Quickness, Intell., and Presence of The Master.
Great Mastery line for him, and quickness+Presence just make him oh~ so sweet to murder with.
Summoner Spells: Flash is mandatory. Learn it, love it. It helps you get in and out of scary situations. From here, I typically grab teleport, Cleanse, Exhaust (with cripple=assured gank) Rally (for hard pushes and stand-offs.), or Clarity if you're having trouble keeping your mana up. I'd try and stray away from everything else as they are either just not useful to you, or you can surrogate Flash/Cannibalism for it.
Prioritize an early game Enrage, and perhaps even a second rank if you're farming well with no gank expectations, with Shield soon after to start pushing and farming mass-last hits. After level three, your priorities shift to: Shield, Stun, Enrage, Cann.
Finally, to the game plan with AP Sion:
You have a big ass and hit hard early game, use it to your advantage. You'll be taking chops with Enrage early on overextended carries and overzealous tanks, or if you got bush early game, taking a couple chunks out of anyone passing by you and your part. early game. This makes them use resources and instills fear of your chops.
Level 2, you have Shield. It absorbs damage and blows up, hard, in the opposition's face. Use this primarily for last hitting 4-5 creeps at a time with Enrage on, building up your HP & gold score. However, make a "cycle" making it look like you're just farming creeps and creeps and lone, doing a little rotation a few times with shield, but this time extend a bit more on that Yi, take a chop, Exhaust, blow up and watch him run home. you're now in a better position than your enemy, thus lane control. Easy~peasy. Oh, and don't lane with other champions that are very last-hit dependant/prone: Nasus, Veigar, Eve., etc. . .
Level 3, you gots' a short CD, point-click stun. Absolutely useful for most things in the game (research, I'm already typing a lot here.) It does awesome ranged damage when pumped and stops everything dead in their tracks for 2 seconds, at every rank.
Now comes the fun part! :D By this point, you should be cusping the funds for Sheen and Boots, allowing the use of the "combo". Yes, the "combo" deserves its own paragraph. To initiate the "combo" you have Sheen on you, activate Shield and wait a few second for the CD, engage enemy with a chop (proccing Sheen)--you can also use exhaust here if you have it up for definite results--, pop Stun, take another chop (proccing Sheen again), Explode shield, and take a final chop. This should have dropped your enemy to either death or %12 or so of his/her life. Use Flash and Chop for a probably kill. Learn this sequence and it'll serve you well.
That's the starter AP Sion guide, and I hope it's both insightful and helpful!
Shameless bump; you're welcome, Kootz.
To be honest i simply didnt know. i just recently learned about ap sion and how to play him.
that magic pen rune choice was definatly something i missed.. but i have magic pen runes instead of armor pen now so its all good..
So far all the advice i have gotten is really great. thank you all for your help.
One thing i really need to work on is my early game. i cannot seem to get the kills i need to really rack up the cash.. and often times i find myself the victem of a gank if i go to shield bombing the creeps..
i would say currently im having the most trouble with lvl 1-10.. and bulding up sion in a fast manner.
Lets say you run in at the start and blow up shield --> other 2 heroes gank you as soon as its down.
Lets say you let them push you back to the tower with 2 waves up creeps, THEN blow up shield. You're sitting under the tower with 2 waves of nearly dead creeps, they're not going to come too close for fear of being stunned and tower-killed.
Of course it's a little different if you have 2 melee vs 2 ranged dps in lane, but generally speaking... just learn patience.
The advantage AP Sion has over DPS is that you're not initially as hit or miss as you would be DPS Sion. If you die one or even two times early on, you're still a lane threat with AE damage and a decently damaging stun. Your shield absorbs a lot more punishment and does a ton more damage, clearning more minion waves and pushing lanes far more quickly than his DPS variant.
Within a realistic game, AP Sion is more bursty, using Lich Bane, has better overall damage output, better survivability and gives the opposition a reason to invest in magic resist, pushing resource, in contrast to DPS Sion; your proposed variant of Sion is absolutely more circumstancial than my build I've posted.
IMO, there's no contest. AP is strictly better with what Big S's got going for him, and it's easy to argue in his favor.
You're talking to a guy who started with DPS Sion, and ran him exclusively for 3 weeks. Then, I played AP, and immediately realized his potential in a team at all phases of them game.
So Sion is the hardest hitting aoe character in the game right now. Basically the extra auto attack damage, and lifestealing and attack speed from ulting makes him a melee beast. To turn that beast into an unstoppable war machine just pick up 2 Tiamats so your attacks do 100% splash. You end up hitting for 450 dps aoe with 450 lifestealing a second while your ult is up.
I get Shield > Stun > Shield > Extra hp > Shield > Ult > Shield > Extra hp > etc.
I like to get the hp/mana parts of tiamat first. Then basic boots and a scythe. I then finish tiamat, finish ninja tabi boots, and then make another Tiamat, and then a phage to slow runners. Upgrade the phage to a frozen mallet and then make two more tiamats if the game allows. GG. Most of my runes are attack speed, with 2 hp quints and yellow hp@18.
Add in a Kayle to invulnerable you and you can aoe kill 2-3 people in the invulnerability.
I like to go 21 defensive since you are up front with 9 in offense for all the attack speed as well.
Rally + flash is really nice for this...you can start with a dragon kill. Rally + 2 shields takes out the dragon np.
I have played both and I just find aoe melee Sion to do roughly 5-10x as much aoe damage. 160 AP from a pair of rods of ages (what you can get for 2 Tiamats and a scythe) adds 160 damage every 8 seconds or 20 aoe dps to a shield. 2 Tiamats adds 450 aoe damage a second...
One of the two is 20x better then the other.
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