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-   -   sky set (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3045297)

Gunbladefire 01-25-2013 08:23 PM

sky set
 
first off, these are items that I would love to see added to the game they would give support and attack speed builds interesting choices without being too op. I gave great consideration to these items and received feed back from those who have played this game much longer than I (since beta this person has played). 5 new items altogether.





First item: moonstone, tier 2 item moonstone
l
------------
l l
sapphire crystal, sapphire crystal
cost: 1200 gold
450 mana
unique passive: replenishes 2 mana per basic attack






second item: eagle feather, tier 1 item
cost: 200 gold
10 movement speed









third item: moonfire dragonfly, tier 3 item

moonfire dragonfly
l
--------------------------------
l l
moonstone, eagle feather
cost:2800 gold
500 mana
20 movement speed
unique passive:lunar power- 4 mana replenished per basic attack
unique active: fly high- causes nearby enemy champions and minions to be knocked up into the air and stunned for 1 sec. cooldown is 35sec.






fourth item: solar flare, tier 3 item

solar flare
l
--------------------
l l
moonstone, ruby crystal
cost:2650
500 mana
300 health
unique passive: lunar power- replenishes 4 mana per every basic attack
unique active: solar sight- casts into an area of fog of war and reveals certain area for 30 seconds and creates a ring of fire around the casting champion that deals 5% magic damage based on current health. Lasts for 3-4 seconds and has a cool-down of 50 seconds.




fifth item (final item), celestial comet, tier 3 item

celestial comet
l
---------------------------------------------------
l l l
moonstone , faerie charm , faerie charm
cost:1250 gold
650 mana
60 ability power
unique passive: Fate's path- replenishes 5 mana per every basic attack and 10 mana regeneration per 5 seconds.



I look forward to feedback if these items would be viable, overpowered, underpowered, not needed etc..... I enjoy constructive criticism and love to see the reasoning to your conclusions on this and hope that you will be able to provide clear feedback thank you.

The Lord Impaler 01-26-2013 02:00 AM

The Mana on basic attacks is kind interesting, but make all versions of it just one Unique Passive, the Moonstone (ironically) is listed as not having "lunar power" so it would stack with the upgraded version of itself, that should be avoided.

Also it seems this Moonstone should be built out of a weapon (Longsword?) as its working on Basic attack and anyone who wants it is clearly going to be building AD and would probably not have the 1200 gold to spare to get something which is purely to fix their mana hunger. A simple Longsword + Sapphire Crystal recipe should work, just reduce the mana to say 300 and add say 15 attack damage. This would potentially be useful on someone like Sivir who typically build attack speed and is mana hungry.

Follow up recipes all naturally go out the window if the base item changes, some of the active effects are interesting but I don't think the whole items are really very cohesive, who is supposed to buy these things, supports, carries, bruisers? I'm also a little worried that this Eagle Feather will be abused because its speed (which I assume is raw speed) isn't unique and someone could stack em for a considerable speed boost, the only limiter is that its so slot-inefficient. Might make an interesting ingredient item in some of the boot upgrades though like boots of swiftness.

Gunbladefire 01-26-2013 09:39 AM

yes it could use some tweeks but not gone all together
 
I think some of the rearranging for the basic items would be decent and lowering the mana amount may be needed. However not all passives (as far as I'm aware) do not carry over such as the Avarice Blade that gives 2 gold per 10 sec, but Executioner's Calling does not; if it does then just leave the passive from the moonstone and have it carryover on its own making the items still very viable. As for the gold costs I compared these items to the items already available with nearly the same amount of mana and skills...they may be lowered due to the lower mana that may be needed. These items could be very used for a support easily (in my opinion) or for a ad carry. I will wait for a few more replys until I make another post on the updated items to ensure a more well-rounded response (though I know I will never be able to please everyone I will happily settle for a modest agreement between fellow summoners). Please anyone please feel free to give more constructive criticism.


I do not see anyone stacking the eagle feather just for the movement speed though it would be funny to watch considering the person would no have much attack or defense (early game), but I do think it would be great to use the eagle feather as an expansion to new boots or upgraded boots. Also here is a comparison Boots of Speed 25movement (I know it does not stack), eagle feather 10 movement, for early movement I think I would recommend the boots and then later the eagle feather (though the feather could just as easily help with a more cost efficient build in early game).

JustMyBassCannon 01-26-2013 09:55 AM

There is no constructive criticism I can give to this post.

The criticism I CAN give is this; none of these items fill any niches in item design that haven't been shot down by Riot, and all of them are either worthless or overpowered.

The mana regain per hit has always been a fascinating idea, but it has been proven that basically, it will either not regain enough mana to be worth using, or it will regain enough that champions who normally wouldn't focus on auto attacks would take it. The middle ground is very thin if you consider balancing this around ONE champion; if you tried to balance it around all 100+ champions, you'd either give up or go insane. This is why a select few champions (Taric, Kassadin and Jayce) have mana regain per hit; their kits are balanced around it.

A non-boots item giving move speed, especially since I'm assuming you didn't make it Unique, would be rather powerful, unless it had no upgrade tiers, or maybe only one. However, unless it were powerful enough to warrant taking, it would be at best a niche item on certain champions, if not just utterly useless.

Hard CC is NEVER going to be put on items. Period. End of discussion.

With that other item, you've basically created an item that gives Clairvoyance, PLUS it apparently has a damage AoE (not sure if it's centered on where it's used or on the champion using it, text is weird). It's bad enough that you're making a way for someone to have 2 Clairvoyances to consistently rotate between.

That massive mana-only item would literally only be used by Ryze. Not even Blitzcrank and Singed would want an item that gives only mana and mana regen.


NONE of these items are balanced. They're either worthless or overpowered, and none of them fill a niche.

Gunbladefire 01-26-2013 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustMyBassCannon (Hozzászólás 33913875)
There is no constructive criticism I can give to this post.

The criticism I CAN give is this; none of these items fill any niches in item design that haven't been shot down by Riot, and all of them are either worthless or overpowered.

The mana regain per hit has always been a fascinating idea, but it has been proven that basically, it will either not regain enough mana to be worth using, or it will regain enough that champions who normally wouldn't focus on auto attacks would take it. The middle ground is very thin if you consider balancing this around ONE champion; if you tried to balance it around all 100+ champions, you'd either give up or go insane. This is why a select few champions (Taric, Kassadin and Jayce) have mana regain per hit; their kits are balanced around it.

A non-boots item giving move speed, especially since I'm assuming you didn't make it Unique, would be rather powerful, unless it had no upgrade tiers, or maybe only one. However, unless it were powerful enough to warrant taking, it would be at best a niche item on certain champions, if not just utterly useless.

Hard CC is NEVER going to be put on items. Period. End of discussion.

With that other item, you've basically created an item that gives Clairvoyance, PLUS it apparently has a damage AoE (not sure if it's centered on where it's used or on the champion using it, text is weird). It's bad enough that you're making a way for someone to have 2 Clairvoyances to consistently rotate between.

That massive mana-only item would literally only be used by Ryze. Not even Blitzcrank and Singed would want an item that gives only mana and mana regen.


NONE of these items are balanced. They're either worthless or overpowered, and none of them fill a niche.

Did you read my other post? and besides I think these items would be viable easily for ranged characters as well other than just ryze such as ashe, fortune, and graves.

Emoomoo 01-26-2013 02:23 PM

The Eagle Feather would be more interesting if it were combined with boots to create Boots of Mobility or Boots of Swiftness. Seeing how both do not have a item that combines them such as Ninja Tabi and Mercury Treads.

Sleeper Cell 01-26-2013 03:31 PM

Eagle Feather seems like an awesome item for early on. Make the movement speed a "named" Unique Passive to avoid stacking it. I like the idea of it going together with the on-hit mana resoration item. However, the active on Dragonfly is downright overpowered and hard cc should never be coupled together with an item. It needs to be changed to something more passive, perhaps something regarding movement speed and mana. Such as: Grants a buff to self/target ally that grants movement and attack speed based on level. Also having Eagle Feather as a component in Boots of Swiftness would be cool.

The whole basic attacks restore mana idea on Moonstone is awesome but it adds an incentive for a support to basic attack minions which isn't really what we want to happen. I think this should actually be replaced with a constant effect that causes you and all nearby allies' basic attacks to restore mana to you, with allies' basic attacks granting twice the amount of your basic attacks. That way your ad carry can farm without you disturbing the wave and you still get mana for it. And if the situation allows you to you can go ahead and help mash down a wave for even more mana rewards.

Also I really like the Solar Flare idea. Still, seems overpowered in that it is essentially better than clairvoyance. Maybe add a shorter range on it, I'm talking slightly outside sight range range. Also, perhaps add a slight slowing effect (15%) to it, because just straight 5% damage doesn't seem right for a supporting item.

JustMyBassCannon 01-26-2013 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gunbladefire (Hozzászólás 33915350)
Did you read my other post? and besides I think these items would be viable easily for ranged characters as well other than just ryze such as ashe, fortune, and graves.

I did skim over it, and that's why I gave you a warning before writing my own thoughts about your suggestions. You went on the internet and asked for criticism. While there wasn't anything positive I could say, I made sure to be polite about it at least. And the only thing you can say in response to any of my valid criticism--negative, but valid--is that you THINK the item that just gives 650 Mana, 10 MP5 and 5 mana per hit would be viable on Ranged carries.

Your definition of viable and the actual definition set by good players are many leagues apart. A carry is a champion that wants all damage items. If they wanted a damage item that gave mana, they'd grab Manamune/Muramana instead of this PoS, because they'd get more mana, enough regen, and to top it off they'd get a minimum 25-40 AD and that toggle to deal 3% of their mana in damage per hit.

And yet, that item sees almost no play in high ELO. Wanna know why? Because it provides less damage, and really is just an excuse to spam skills. And the only champions who need it are Ezreal (debatable), Urgot and Yorick.


You can try to convince me it's viable, but speaking from years of experience, it's not.

The Lord Impaler 01-27-2013 12:53 AM

How about an item that gives a speed bonus that scales with current mana, much the way Chalice's Mana Font scales mana regen based on current Mana. As you run out of mana you get a speed boost, great for Bust mages to run away when they are OOM. Say you get a 10% speed bonus at No mana. Their really are no speed boosting items other then boots made for mages, Phantom Dancers, Zephr etc etc are all AD items that no mage would ever buy.

Gunbladefire 01-27-2013 09:29 AM

thank you
 
I'd like to thank you all for your criticism and advice and I am currently working on overhauling these items to make them useable, reliable, and be able to fulfill certain niches that would benefit the community. I know this will not happen in a day, but I will work to adjust these item over days, week, and possibly months to reach a true consensus. This is a personal project born of seer creativity and thought. I will try to post an update on these items weekly and keep up with recommendations. BTW due to popular demand I will keep the Eagle Feather and try to incorporate boot builds into it maybe even make it a unique passive. And once again thank you for the advice and criticism I look forward to providing interesting, but viable items to be made.


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