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-   -   Shyvana's State in Season 3 (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3018892)

Jordman3 01-18-2013 11:49 PM

Shyvana's State in Season 3
Hello, I'm here to discuss Shyvana in season 3. I've been playing Shyvana jungle/top since release, and she is my fave champion. I just love her skill set. However I've been finding in season 3, Shyvana is overlooked by so many other champions. With all of the new champions, and champion reworks, there are just so many other options to fulfill her role. IMO, she also feels slightly weaker in season 3. I've tried many different builds, rune/mastery pages, but I just feel like Shyvana doesnt have as much of a presence as she did in season 2. It might just be me but, I think she could use some slight buffs/tweaks. Maybe some slight stat buffs. I'm not too sure, I'm sure other players will have some ideas though. This is just my personal feedback on Shyvana.

Estred Shantile 01-19-2013 01:17 AM

She doesn't have as much as she used to. The new items and jungle have very much harmed her imo. I made a thread with a suggestion to give her a new dash-type skill that is based on skillful use of Flamebreath, though as usual with these forums half the responses you get are of this type.

- "You noob you no know what you sayin"
- Random flames and "X champ not UP learn 2 play"
- Or actual feedback.

If you want take a look but I don't have my hopes up. Many seem convinced that Shyv lost nothing in the Jungle revamp and she really has not to mention most new-champs can out duel her in more ways than one making her Top lane very weak too, she is just too easy to counter pick with not only 1 or 2 really good counters but like 7.

copperpoint 01-19-2013 02:57 AM

hi, I am a Shyvana fan too. (Just wanted to open a thread myself)
And yes, she definately lacks some kind of edge other then ONLY good stats. Which are by far not enough to make up for her more then lacking kit.

I think she was invented with the thought of making a tank, but removing all the usuall capcloser, heal cc stuff they usually have and replace it with the dmg of a bruiser.
They got the dmg somewhat right, but she is nowhere near a real tank.

She is designed as a counterjungler (somewhat). The problem is that she has no scout, smite replacement, gold bonus or escape to make up for the high risk (compared to the rather low benefit you would get by cj)
And her dueling is pretty bad too, most other champs outclass her. Any champ with sustain, escapes or cc totally dictates the outcome of the fight. (in most cases)

a) Kiting- besides her ulti she doesnt have a gapcloser or cc. I can live with that. But then she should have some kind of anticc effect. Like a bonus on her ulti or a removal effect on her firespin when activated (see Garren - he is pretty similar in that regard)
b) dueling- she "CAN" do dmg, with a pretty big "IF...".
c) items and scaling: Half of her kit scales of AP. The fireball doesnt scale at all (except for the low dmg) I like the idea that she does some magic dmg scaling of ad, but thats only her w, whats with the rest ?
Her design is kinda twisted which makes it really hard to pick items for her. Good champs usually push 1-3 stats which make the existing kit stronger. She sometimes feels as is you have to buy way more items to actually get a kit.
d) I hate her "e", why is it ranged, why is it a skillshot, why doesnt it scale, why not on AD, why should anyone avoid it ?

How to play her? Currently she is either a hard to play top laner or an afk jungler, in both cases she feels more like an adc. Waiting for at least 2 or 3 items before she really starts to roll.

She is fun to play if you like the high difficulty. But there are way more then just one or 2 champs that are a way saver pick, for whatever you want to do with her.

So what would be a good buff for her ?
personally I would like to see the following changes on her:
a) When activating her firespin all cc effects are removed from her. While the firespin is active you get a bonus of 25% tenacity(stacking).
b) Her flambreath scales of ad. Maybe a totally different effect, like halfing healing, true damage, gold, ignite when below X% health, on hit effect... or give it arm/mgpen instead of only armor shred.
c) Her bonus on her ulti is increased. 10/15/20 is really low even when doubled. Maybe she could get a tenacity bonus when in dragon form.

There are a couple of threads in the EU forum as well:

Kaisha 01-19-2013 05:49 AM

I loved shyv S2 but in S3 she's useless. Too easily kited and everyone does so much more dmg = dead shyv long before you can close. Season 3 is a mess IMO.

iRigel 01-19-2013 08:36 AM

I love Shyvanas, she was the first 6300 IP I ever bought since Im playing LOL, she used to be one of the most scary beasts If you knew how to play her properly.

Everyone knows that shyvanas ganks aren't that succesful as other junglers, the trick of owning with her was instead of gank stay always ready to countergank, counterjungling whenever you're not able to countergank your allies and outfarming with your abilities.

Actually, these jungle's changes makes it harder for champ that used "Aoe spells" to clean it faster and these new items to clean the jungle way faster are based on basic attacks...

As you can see, she had being indirectly nerfed, hard nerf, she has no ANY CC, she needs that cleaning jungle speed to compensate her lack CC.

Actually, she can't clean the jungle faster than Nocturne, WHY? Simple at lvl 2 Nocturne get his shield that passively grant him 20% att speed which makes an amazing synergy with the new item that helps cleaning the jungle faster with basic attacks.

Nocturne has maybe the most scary ganks in-game, CC, Fear and a shield that block even Caitlyn ulti, after knowing it, you really think that playing Shyvanas in ranked is worth it? Of course NO, Its sad I know but what can I tell, I bought Nocturne and he's a beast I'll be playing him until RIOT realizes "What has they done to Shyvanas".

PD: Sorry for my bad english, Im still learning :)
PD: I didn't even bought Darkflames Shyvanas on sale because I'll not use her until Riot FIX/BUFF or Rework her habilities, she's broken at the moment. (I know, I must be patient It may takes months or years in case of Karma)

Renanthera 01-19-2013 09:28 AM

Agreed, I mained Shyvana in Season 2 and fell in love with her playstyle. Since she's fallen out of favor, I'd been playing Mundo instead, but he doesn't give the same "oomph" that she did. Don't get me wrong, Mundo is a monster, but there was fun and power in Shyvana's superior movement speed and ferocious initiation.

Now I'm stuck with a champ that doesn't sit well with me. I am enjoying other speedy junglers like Nocturne, but none can replace Shyvana to me.

I can't pinpoint a problem with her exactly, but it's a combination of the stronger jungle camps, and the lack of synergy she gets from the new and popular Season 3 items.

Her kit feels lackluster now, and even if you somehow manage to get yourself fed, any other jungler fed to the same degree would just be stronger anyways. Now her primary source of damage (magic) isn't optimal for her to snag even in the mastery tree, since magic penetration requires ability power as a prerequisite. Which I guess wouldn't be too bad, but Shyvana also desperately needs the attack speed bonus to clear and abuse her twin fangs.

I don't know, maybe she's in need of a few changes.
I would love to see something that makes her ganks a tad stronger, if not just her jungling itself.
Being in the enemy jungle and steal camps left and right was extremely satisfying, but now it's a struggle to pull off, and even if done correctly, you'll typically be there too damaged or too long.

Riot, any ideas?

Jordman3 01-19-2013 10:27 AM

Thanks for all the amazing feedback and ideas, I'm happy that it's not just me who feels this way about Shyvana. I like the idea of having her W clear cc effects when activated, or maybe even just slows at least. Also another idea was to maybe slightly buff her attack speed per level.

pineluv 01-19-2013 10:40 AM

her kit does kinda suck. i think what she exists for is to counter-jungle, repress the enemy jungler, and land the occasional successful gank.

if this worked, she'll out-tank their jungler and their team can win more effectively.

however her lack of cc considering the role she's playing is pretty annoying. and that flame skillshot attack is a bit useless, save for teamfights in dragon form.

Suaroth 01-19-2013 10:48 AM

roit pls

Elf Elix 01-19-2013 11:22 AM

she's one of the few people trundles ult does anything effective to...

From the short times I've played her (f2p once maybe twice) she feels so useless late game. Destroying turrets, OK she's great with that attack speed, but stacking damage seems like the meta.
Her ult, I think it needs tweaked, but alas I haven't played her long enough to give a strong enough opinion.

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