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-   -   Tryndamere Debate (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2954440)

MrCayke 12-29-2012 08:46 PM

Tryndamere Debate
 
Alright, I'm here to give my pros and cons of Tryndamere, but I'd also like to get some opinions.

I've been using Tryndamere since he was once (and pretty much only once) in the champion cycle, many many months ago. He was pretty cheap and I have a thing for barbarians, so I bought him. Since then I've become quite the overpowered piece of cr*p. I even bought his legendary skin.

I just recently hit level 30, so I'm starting to prepare myself for jumping into Ranked. However, I've been debating and researching how viable Tryndamere would be in Ranked, and a lot of people are saying he's downright terrible. I think otherwise. I've played against Tryndamere, and I've played with Tryndamere on my team, I've seen people play Tryndamere on YouTube. But I always see them and can't help but think "You're bad. I'm better."

So allow me to list his ups and downs, and we'll see how good he'd be in a ranked game.


Pros:
  • Incredible damage, increasing as health is lost;
  • Damage-increasing passive
  • Great engage and getaway;
  • Damage-reducing skill that's a flat-out anti-adc when maxed out;
  • One of the most effective slows in the game;
  • Ultimate that allows enough damage to be dealt for a good escape/push;
  • Can be a good jungler (great mobility, quick clearance, strong ganks);
  • Self-sustaining with a decent heal;
  • Up to 35% free critical chance at max Fury;
  • When slowed, can spin out to safety;
  • Ultimate immune to silence, suppression, etc.

Cons:
  • Highly vulnerable to slows and stuns (especially stuns);
  • Useless if blinded;
  • Not much HP, easily ganked and melts in teamfights*;
  • Mostly item-dependent;
  • Definitely useless against enough CC.
*That's what his ultimate is for.

I'm not asking for you to tell me how terrible you think he is, unless you have enough facts to back you up. I understand how conditional he is (should only be used with enough CC on your team and not much on the other), but I'm just asking for some constructive opinions. Personally, looking at all the positive output he can give to the team, I wouldn't think twice before using him if the situation applies.
Thanks for the feedback.

EDIT: Many see Tryndamere as a "noob champ that only noobs play". You could say that for a lot of champs, but I guarantee you that if played right, Tryndamere is a hell of a bruiser.

AwkwardRainbow 12-29-2012 08:55 PM

imo he is very underrated and he isn't half bad but then again if you pick tryndamere your team will hate and spit **** at you.

MrCayke 12-29-2012 08:57 PM

I've gotten a lot of hate for choosing Tryndamere. I usually just say "You'll see." then carry the team.

Master Moirich 12-29-2012 08:58 PM

Well he used to be played all the time. And then he got nerfed. And then they released Darius.

Anyway, if you have to play him, crit, lifesteal, health, and a guardians angel. (The new mercurial scimitar works well on similar champs who suffer from being cc'd/kited. Or run cleanse. Or both)

MrCayke 12-29-2012 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Master Moirich (Hozzászólás 32971108)
Well he used to be played all the time. And then he got nerfed. And then they released Darius.

Anyway, if you have to play him, crit, lifesteal, health, and a guardians angel. (The new mercurial scimitar works well on similar champs who suffer from being cc'd/kited. Or run cleanse. Or both)

I hadn't considered the scimitar. I'll add that to my late-game build, thanks.

Gramps69 12-29-2012 09:07 PM

The thing is his laning phase and the build he requires to be effective are both pretty bad.

During laning phase he is very vulnerable, and he's a melee champ, so any teemo/kennen he runs into will ruin him. The sustain from his Q reduces his damage and crit chance, so it's only worth it if you really need it or aren't keeping your rage bar filled. He's not the easiest champ to gank as long as he has his spin and his ult to prevent tower dives. Trynd will lose most trades early game until he gets a few items also.

His build is what really gets him. He is a melee carry, which makes his day pretty rough due to the poor itemization for melee carries.
Tryndamere needs:
-Attack Damage
-Attack Speed
-Crit Chance
-Lifesteal to stay alive

So a basic Tryndamere build would have:
-Choice boots
-Infinity Edge
-Phantom Dancer
-Bloodthirster

These are all core items, and none of them except maybe the boots are defensive at all. You could use your last 2 item slots to get defensive items, but you really don't have great options that would still benefit you. The QSS upgrade seems like a good one for Trynd, but it is pretty expensive, and his build already requires a TON of gold.

TL;DR: Trynd's laning phase is pretty weak, and his itemization and gold dependency really cripple him. I like Tryndamere, I think he is one of the most fun champs to play with his suicidal God-mode ult, but he's not viable for ranked right now.

Boyahda 12-29-2012 09:11 PM

His Q has low synergy with his kit. He has push the lane in order to build fury which opens him for ganks. When it comes to trades: he'll win the trade if he crits but he doesn't he gets stomped. Its not my style to rely on luck to win lanes.

MrCayke 12-29-2012 09:12 PM

@Gramps69: I'm well aware of all that. I tried to make it clear in the main post that I know he can only be used in specific cases and one or two measly factors render him useless. I've had enough time to work on laning and building with him, and although I sometimes struggle early game, I pick up very well as soon as I grab the first item of my build (Phantom Dancer). I'm always aware of possible and impending ganks.

General Quackers 12-29-2012 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrCayke (Hozzászólás 32970778)
Pros:
  • Incredible damage, increasing as health is lost;
  • Damage-increasing passive
  • Great engage and getaway;
  • Damage-reducing skill that's a flat-out anti-adc when maxed out;
  • One of the most effective slows in the game;
  • Ultimate that allows enough damage to be dealt for a good escape/push;
  • Can be a good jungler (great mobility, quick clearance, strong ganks);
  • Self-sustaining with a decent heal;
  • Up to 35% free critical chance at max Fury;
  • When slowed, can spin out to safety;
  • Ultimate immune to silence, suppression, etc.

  • Does more damage than Ashe but less damage than Vayne
  • Crit chance doesn't directly boost your damage, it has a change to boost your damage
  • Great engage OR getaway; it's hardly ever both, especially since they put that fat CD on his E
  • Yeah, it's decent
  • Uh.. what? Wither is one of the most effective slows in the game; Mocking Shout has a chance to not even be a slow
  • This is highly situational
  • Tryndamere needs gold to be good and junglers do not have gold; he's a pretty awful jungler in S3
  • If he can hit things without getting beat on too much
  • Up to a 35% chance to have a basic attack deal more damage, woot
  • Did you really list "gap closer" as a pro twice?
  • No, no, no. His ultimate is not immune to hard CC; his ult can still be used if under hard CC, but the hard CC is still keeping Trynd CC'd

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrCayke (Hozzászólás 32970778)
Cons:
  • Highly vulnerable to slows and stuns (especially stuns);
  • Useless if blinded;
  • Not much HP, easily ganked and melts in teamfights*;
  • Mostly item-dependent;
  • Definitely useless against enough CC.

  • Yep
  • Yep
  • He has high base health, but he's too squishy for it to matter
  • Not mostly, he's completely item dependent
  • Yep
  • Also, he's single target focused melee but dealing less damage than ranged ADC's like Graves, Ezreal, Vayne, and Corki.

Tryndamere is garbage at the moment; so is Fiora for that matter. Gangplank is having similar problems with inadequate damage for being a melee ranged item dependent champ. AP Yi got more popular because a bunch of sheep saw the Russian kid get a pentakill, but that will be very, very short lived. Of the four melee ADCs in this game, not one of them is in a good spot; it's been this way for too long.

MrCayke 12-29-2012 09:34 PM

I suppose you're right on that. But again, there are certain cases where he can be highly effective. I agree that he can't be commonly used as a viable carry.

P.S. I didn't quite repeat the same pro twice, in the first I just meant he could spin over walls to get away from a bad jungle fight, while the second meant that, even if slowed, his spin covers good distance.
Also, his Q passively increases his attack damage. I wasn't talking about his passive skill (though I admit I was unintentionally misleading).


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