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-   -   Amumu needs tweaking! (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2919469)

Seymorbuttz 12-19-2012 01:16 AM

Amumu needs tweaking!
 
So just recently I played a un ranked 5v5 game in which we lost because usually before Amumu's ult was over two to three teammates were dead. His ratios are fine, stats fine. His ult however is to large! I have seen adcs get clipped by it just on the edge. You don't need to hit someone with the Bandage Toss for it to be effective if you miss and hit a minion you just ult anyway. If you miss the toss all together you just flash and ult.

I am an experienced jungler and I did kill him twice in his jungle before lvl 6, and stole a lot of his camps. However this has little to no effect on late game. It doesn't matter if he dies after he ults because when re-spawns are one min long hes going to have his ult up for every team fight. I know I am not the only one that feels this way about his ult. However I feel like a small tweak to its range and increasing its rank 3 cool-down would fix this problem.

Peligrad 12-19-2012 03:19 AM

Yeah...Amumu is retardedly tanky, retardedly disruptive, and deals absurd damage...simultaneously.

He needs a nerf fudging sledgehammer...

His bandage toss CD should honestly be doubled and his despair damage reduced significantly...with those nerfs he would still be solid..but not outrageously over powered.

He is on a tier of his own right now.

Amumu, Lee Sin, and Darius

1,2,3 for the strongest champs in the game currently...

Onimus Terlain 12-19-2012 04:49 AM

Take his blue.
Harass him in jungle.
Out gank him.

Your team will win.
He's a tank. But if he can't gank, his teammates can't get farmed. If his teammate can't get farmed, three of your champs getting rooted for 2 seconds or less every teamfight won't mean an autoloss.

I'd be more weary of junglers that can actually kill 1v1. Those guys are dangerous in this new jungle. Tanks took a major hit when the HoG and Philo stone build went up in smoke.

Peligrad 12-19-2012 05:07 AM

Stealing an amumu's blue shouldn't be easy...

It is literally his only counter...so any team with a brain should expect and be there to defend him.

if you don't have a strong level 1 team, you've got no chance. Even if you do, invading is dangerous and face checking brush means death if they're prepared.

Amumu has great ganks. Out ganking him is no simple feat... with two CCs, great tankiness, and retardedly strong dps (plus mr shred), Amumu is not easy to out gank.

Beating up amumu in his jungle is also hard. As an AD, he will be heavily stacked armor and the new masteries such as indomitable and block really cut back your early damage.

Plus Amumu can bandage toss nearby camps to escape... and as always being behind enemy lines is always a big risk.

No matter how bad you shut down amumu early...he comes back. His kit scale retardedly well...and it scales against players inherently. Your AS improves, his DPS improves...your HP improves, his dps improves...

Plus his ult single handedly destroys teams...

In the finals of the last tourny, Amumu was played every game...and the team that won each match had him...

In all 3 games, the determining team fight was decided by a well placed bandage toss followed up by an ult (or once a flash over a wall followed by an ult).

Amumu wins games...single handedly... that's why he is banned or played in every ranked game...that's why he has a steady 55% win rate every single day across all ELOs...

He needs the bat something fierce...

Onimus Terlain 12-19-2012 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peligrad (Hozzászólás 32610900)
Stealing an amumu's blue shouldn't be easy...

It is literally his only counter...so any team with a brain should expect and be there to defend him.

if you don't have a strong level 1 team, you've got no chance. Even if you do, invading is dangerous and face checking brush means death if they're prepared.

Amumu has great ganks. Out ganking him is no simple feat... with two CCs, great tankiness, and retardedly strong dps (plus mr shred), Amumu is not easy to out gank.

Beating up amumu in his jungle is also hard. As an AD, he will be heavily stacked armor and the new masteries such as indomitable and block really cut back your early damage.

Plus Amumu can bandage toss nearby camps to escape... and as always being behind enemy lines is always a big risk.

No matter how bad you shut down amumu early...he comes back. His kit scale retardedly well...and it scales against players inherently. Your AS improves, his DPS improves...your HP improves, his dps improves...

Plus his ult single handedly destroys teams...

In the finals of the last tourny, Amumu was played every game...and the team that won each match had him...

In all 3 games, the determining team fight was decided by a well placed bandage toss followed up by an ult (or once a flash over a wall followed by an ult).

Amumu wins games...single handedly... that's why he is banned or played in every ranked game...that's why he has a steady 55% win rate every single day across all ELOs...

He needs the bat something fierce...

The reason it’s easy to invade his blue level 1 is because he is basically a minion with high hp at level 1. If you have a blitzcrank or a Darius or any other strong insolating champion, invading Amumu sets him back at least 5 minutes, regardless of how many people he brings to his blue. From there, just ward your own blue and kill him if he tries to take it to redeem his early game.
From there, he can barely gank until his second blue comes up. His farm slows down exponentially, his mana is used up just farming his jungle and he has no sustain so he is usually pretty low hp if he isn’t using his mana to farm. Chances are he won’t even be capable of ganking until his 3rd or maybe 4th time back in the jungle.
Don’t overextend and his ganks are piss poor until he’s level 6. Dodge his Q and it’s like he isn’t even there. His W does relatively low damage early game and his E is extremely short range. So unless you have 0 gap closers, 0 knockbacks/CC, 0 damage and the worst possible movement speed, an amumu gank is not very threatening.

When it comes to out ganking, counter gank him. Meaning, notice when your lanes are pushing and head towards it. Amumu will appear, you come in, wreck some **** because he is so underfarmed, and then he will retreat. If he runs into his lower jungle, check his wraiths. If he walks into his upper jungle, check wolves. He is very vulnerable to being quick killed after a failed gank since, as you say, he is a tank and is likely tanking damage on a gank.

He does scale well late game, but keep in mind he is a tank, so he is not building damage. His CC is disruptive, but if you beat him early game, he was not able to get his carries fed and his absence in ganks allowed you to help get your carries fed. Late game he can snare some of you for 2 seconds or less, but afterwards, your carries should be able to take the other team out.

Beating Amumu is all about stopping him early game. I’ve had games where I’ve shut down amumu jungle and he wasn’t good late game and I’ve had games where I was shut down and I was unable to do much late game. His ult, obviously, is a game changer, but you just have to get through it. Galio has a very similar ult, but that doesn’t make him OP.

He is a strong jungler. But his vulnerability early game is what makes up for his super strong late game. If you don’t take advantage of his weakness, it’s difficult to overcome his strength.

I don’t tend to judge the validity of champs based on tournaments. Those guys are so much better than everyone else it’s absurd.

That said, I understand why people think he needs to be nerfed. I just don’t know what to nerf on him. Maybe the damage or mana on his W or E. But his ult already has a super long CD and it isn’t even a true stun. It’s just an AOE root/AA suppressant. Spells can still be cast during it. His bandage toss is just a standard skill shot, no different from Lee Sin’s Q or Blitz’s grab. If his bandage toss is nerfed, those need nerfs too. The reason he isn’t nerfed is because nothing about his skill set, by itself, is OP. But his skillset just meshes very well and fits the meta very very well.

As for his 55% win rate justifying his being OP, then that would mean Miss Fortune is OP, considering she has a steady 55% win rate as well. As does Shaco. And I don’t think anyone could make an argument about either of them being OP. This is a team game, and Amumu is a good teammate. But if his teammates don’t get fed, he does just as little as any other tank. All he does is facilitate them getting fed, which is a tank’s job.

Keitterman 12-19-2012 07:29 AM

Wait! I just started plaing amumu because they won't buff the other tanks I play! Let me have some fun before the nerf bat comes around!

I only got in on the tail end of Rammus being good before they nerfed him...

Besides, what's the matter having Shen, Amumu, and Malphite on the permaban list? I like to think of them as the three Amigos. While there are ten champs playing on the fields ofjustice, those three are back there playing cards or something.

Peligrad 12-19-2012 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onimus Terlain (Hozzászólás 32613295)
Drivel

If you are smart, they won't shut amumu down...get yourself an explorer ward if your in solo que...use your support's if not..

Turn their blue steal attempt into getting first blood for your team...

It's easy enough...

And Shaco and MF might have high win rates...but there %played (and banned especially) is way way less.

MF is a great anti sustain ADC...perfect counter pick for Soraka support.

Shaco assassinates squishy solos with no escape with ease.

These two are reactive counter picks...not a "OH LOOK HE DIDN'T GET BANNED FREE ELO FOR US" pick like Amumu...

Onimus Terlain 12-19-2012 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peligrad (Hozzászólás 32614373)
If you are smart, they won't shut amumu down...get yourself an explorer ward if your in solo que...use your support's if not..

Turn their blue steal attempt into getting first blood for your team...

It's easy enough...

And Shaco and MF might have high win rates...but there %played (and banned especially) is way way less.

MF is a great anti sustain ADC...perfect counter pick for Soraka support.

Shaco assassinates squishy solos with no escape with ease.

These two are reactive counter picks...not a "OH LOOK HE DIDN'T GET BANNED FREE ELO FOR US" pick like Amumu...


I am continuously surprised by most forum goers’ inability to have an intelligent discussion of strategy and counterplaying. I am further surprised by their unending immaturity displayed while they are showing the inability to have an intelligent discussion of strategy and counterplaying.
I don’t know why I bother…:\

Peligrad 12-19-2012 09:57 AM

Ok? So your strategy is to invade Amumu's blue every time u see Amumu...

Well that might work once or twice...but eventually even a pug is going to grow a brain cell and figure out...hey they are going to invade... I think we should all sit in this bush here and murder them as they try to invade.

He sits there without his skill yet selected yet and guess what...if first blood is looking good you take Q first and now Amumu is as useful as taric on an invade/counter invade.

You mob up some sorry sap with a good counter gank and then your team basically kills blue for you (you just smite) now you have a little bonus gold from the kill, blue, and level 2 so taking q first didn't set you back...

You go off on your merry way...murdering and destroying because you are the most over powered champion in the game.

See this is why one single strategy that "counters" a champion doesn't actually counter him...you can't balance a champion based on what goes on at level 1 and say "He's fine, you just have to do this one thing to make him not op..." That's bad game mechanics...and balance...


Besides, I've seen Amumu's survive first clear with out blue...and come back to be a power house anyway... your argument is moot...

Seymorbuttz 12-19-2012 10:30 AM

See thats the problem, he didn't any good ganks in he had blue like once red twice and the game was 4o mins long! His early game had NO effect on his teams late game team fights. No matter what happens to him he gets to stun your whole team for 2 seconds. I'm fine with other AoE stuns, Ex Sona, Cass, they are much harder to land and have a smaller area. I'm just saying he should have his stun's area shrunk, or leave it the same size cut its duration in half. Or increase the cooldown. His early game is actually kind of scary if he does get blue and his early ganks are actually great if you have red and you can land the bandage


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