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-   -   @Riot - An issue with your recent Champion Design (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2917019)

Zan Vorez 12-18-2012 12:21 PM

@Riot - An issue with your recent Champion Design
 
It seems that a number of the champions that have been released in the recent past have had a number of similarity traits in common. Namely, they are insanely tanky naturally, have incredibly high damage, and a ridiculous amount of mobility. While there's nothing inherently wrong with any of these mechanics individually I think it's problematic to give them all to a single champ. Take a look at Diana, who was just nerfed into the ground (and justifiably so). Glance at Jayce, who can shred champions from a distance that even Nidalee would be envious of, and then jump in and tank while still dealing TONS OF DAMAGE. Darius? Yeah (not as much mobility as counter mobility, but you get the idea). Riven doesn't even need boots in theory, and she can tank with the best of them merely by using AD items. Rengar was a huge problem too, he could come out of nowhere with insane burst and then buff his defenses and continue to do high sustained damage. Now it looks like Vi will follow in their footsteps. Why do you okay the design of these champions when you can almost guarantee that any with these features will be undeniably broken? Safe yourself the time of nerfing and pissing off the community and just make more balanced champs. It's not that hard, just stop giving every champion all the things. A champion who does high damage does not need high health. I know tanky DPS is popular, but these champions push to a level beyond tanky DPS. They are tanky burst and they have no place in the game as it is. They simply outclass all the other champs by virtue of their natural stats, synergy with items, and assigned kit. It doesn't even require skill most times.

These champions are incredibly fun and rewarding to play, have little risk taking for high rewards, incredible amounts of room for error, capitalize on the slight errors of others very well, and are just generally nightmares to play against. You're against toxic behavior? Maybe you should focus on your own organization and remove toxic champion design, first.

CerealBoxOfDoom 12-18-2012 12:39 PM

Maybe they should remove toxic players first. People who think they know this game but don't even realize that the game is actually balanced heavily around tanky dps thus when the meta shifts its only natural that tanky dps will be changing as well. But seriously... comparing diana, darius, and rengar to vi? Comparing nid and jayce? What the **** makes you so sure this is even a sound comparison. Have you seen the price darius pays for building tanky or did you just see his hp bar and run away s****ing yourself? Diana wan't nerfed into the ground, they just broke her W, real diana players shouldn't have any problem landing her new ult. Most of her damage is from on-hit effects anyways and she just got a ton of new itemization. She's just losing games now because people insist on playing her in ways she was never meant to be played in the first place. I'm ****ing sick of people giving me that "hurrdurr diana jungle????" whenever I que her

Zan Vorez 12-18-2012 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CerealBoxOfDoom (Hozzászólás 32581618)
Maybe they should remove toxic players first. People who think they know this game but don't even realize that the game is actually balanced heavily around tanky dps thus when the meta shifts its only natural that tanky dps will be changing as well. But seriously... comparing diana, darius, and rengar to vi? Comparing nid and jayce? What the **** makes you so sure this is even a sound comparison. Have you seen the price darius pays for building tanky or did you just see his hp bar and run away s****ing yourself? Diana wan't nerfed into the ground, they just broke her W, real diana players shouldn't have any problem landing her new ult. Most of her damage is from on-hit effects anyways and she just got a ton of new itemization. She's just losing games now because people insist on playing her in ways she was never meant to be played in the first place. I'm ****ing sick of people giving me that "hurrdurr diana jungle????" whenever I que her

You sound pretty toxic to me. For someone preaching about "people who think they know this game" you sure do think you know this game pretty well. Also, you might note that I addressed Riot. Not some random kid who hasn't played a singe match of ranked. Go troll elsewhere.

Anyone with legitimate arguments can feel free to make them, politely, but this is still addressed to Riot employees.

CerealBoxOfDoom 12-18-2012 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zan Vorez (Hozzászólás 32582312)
You sound pretty toxic to me. For someone preaching about "people who think they know this game" you sure do think you know this game pretty well. Also, you might note that I addressed Riot. Not some random kid who hasn't played a singe match of ranked. Go troll elsewhere.

Anyone with legitimate arguments can feel free to make them, politely, but this is still addressed to Riot employees.

Doesn't take a ranked game to understand this game. Alot of ranked players don't know **** either. Especially not low ELOs who think their big stuff because they managed to get 16 champs after reaching level 30.

BTW this "random kid" doesn't run to lolking trying to discredit the person rather than the subject at hand. My **** holds water. This "random kid" also doesn't talk to riot like their a bunch of stupid****es who have never played the game.

I will gladly make a legit arguement and this is as polite as it gets so feel special

profirix 12-18-2012 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CerealBoxOfDoom (Hozzászólás 32582848)
Doesn't take a ranked game to understand this game. Alot of ranked players don't know **** either. Especially not low ELOs who think their big stuff because they managed to get 16 champs after reaching level 30.

BTW this "random kid" doesn't run to lolking trying to discredit the person rather than the subject at hand. My **** holds water. This "random kid" also doesn't talk to riot like their a bunch of stupid****es who have never played the game.

I will gladly make a legit arguement and this is as polite as it gets so feel special

You need to calm down. The OP made a statement and you vehemently attacked him.

X74 12-18-2012 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zan Vorez (Hozzászólás 32580990)
It seems that a number of the champions that have been released in the recent past have had a number of similarity traits in common. Namely, they are insanely tanky naturally, have incredibly high damage, and a ridiculous amount of mobility. While there's nothing inherently wrong with any of these mechanics individually I think it's problematic to give them all to a single champ. Take a look at Diana, who was just nerfed into the ground (and justifiably so). Glance at Jayce, who can shred champions from a distance that even Nidalee would be envious of, and then jump in and tank while still dealing TONS OF DAMAGE. Darius? Yeah (not as much mobility as counter mobility, but you get the idea). Riven doesn't even need boots in theory, and she can tank with the best of them merely by using AD items. Rengar was a huge problem too, he could come out of nowhere with insane burst and then buff his defenses and continue to do high sustained damage. Now it looks like Vi will follow in their footsteps. Why do you okay the design of these champions when you can almost guarantee that any with these features will be undeniably broken? Safe yourself the time of nerfing and pissing off the community and just make more balanced champs. It's not that hard, just stop giving every champion all the things. A champion who does high damage does not need high health. I know tanky DPS is popular, but these champions push to a level beyond tanky DPS. They are tanky burst and they have no place in the game as it is. They simply outclass all the other champs by virtue of their natural stats, synergy with items, and assigned kit. It doesn't even require skill most times.

These champions are incredibly fun and rewarding to play, have little risk taking for high rewards, incredible amounts of room for error, capitalize on the slight errors of others very well, and are just generally nightmares to play against. You're against toxic behavior? Maybe you should focus on your own organization and remove toxic champion design, first.

None of the champions you listed are "naturally insanely tanky", in fact the only way they can be tanky is by sacrificing their high damage output, or if you fed them so much that they just have THAT much more of a gold/level advantage than you. Have you ever considered the fact that Diana's all magic damage/AP based, and that you should probably build magic resist against her? She's a clone of Akali, treat her as such, she does good damage and is durable, but nowhere near as much as a tank unless you fed the hell out of her early game. It's not that she's dealing insane damage while being tanky, it's that you're probably doing absolutely nothing to stop her, or just doing it completely wrong.

Jayce was just nerfed recently and is no longer as godlike as he used to be. Once again, build proper defense and he's not that bad. He's not supposed to be an easy champion to fight, as with all champions.

Riven, I really hope you're kidding. She's not tanky at all, and her shield really doesn't last that long. Have you ever seen a Riven get focused? It's hilarious, and they die quicker than some of the squishiest champs in the game because they have to be RIGHT in their face. She's is SOLELY reliant on damage, if she builds armor, she dies because she can't have that damage output she's sacrificing for it. Build decent amounts of armor early game and watch her die to every gank you pull that has even the slightest bit of cc, or just pick Malphite and laugh as she can't do anything to you. Unless of course, you feed her, which by the sounds of it, you do. I also like how you say that in theory she doesn't need boots, because aside from being completely reliant on AD, she's also completely reliant on mobility due to the fact that cc DESTROYS her.


Lol, Darius. No. I'm not going over this again.

Rengar is now forced to build tanky to survive, therefore giving him much less damage than he had a long time ago. Would you prefer getting bursted down in 3 seconds at level 1, or being able to survive the laning phase to rape him later?

Vi will not be tanky; she can build for a bit of survival, but if you've read the PBE forums you'd have known by now that she can't survive that long in teamfights, much like Diana and Riven.

People like you ARE the toxic behavior. Vi hasn't even been released yet and you're already preemptively making assumptions.

CerealBoxOfDoom 12-18-2012 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by profirix (Hozzászólás 32582942)
You need to calm down. The OP made a statement and you vehemently attacked him.

it wasn't vehement, it was cynical veraciousness.

>:/ I can use ugly wording too!

profirix 12-18-2012 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CerealBoxOfDoom (Hozzászólás 32583286)
it wasn't vehement, it was cynical veraciousness.

>:/ I can use ugly wording too!

indubitably sir but you see, my disposition has not been tarnished by the venom of your demeanor, however you most definitely have been compromised >.>

Zan Vorez 12-18-2012 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by profirix (Hozzászólás 32583407)
indubitably sir but you see, my disposition has not been tarnished by the venom of your demeanor, however you most definitely have been compromised >.>

Don't feed the trolls.

CerealBoxOfDoom 12-18-2012 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zan Vorez (Hozzászólás 32584323)
Don't feed the trolls.

Your trite verbal convention astounds.

DON THE FINEST MONOCLE AVAILABLE TO YOU AT ONCE

damned silly *******! >:/


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