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-   Tribunal Ban Inquiries (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/forumdisplay.php?f=41)
-   -   Only _intentional_ feeding is against the Code (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2914962)

NynaeveaM 12-17-2012 06:57 PM

Feeding has to be intentional in order to be punishable
 
Do you guys agree?

>>EDIT: IF YOU SUPPORT ME YOU CAN UPVOTE MY POST. THAT WAY I HAVE HIGHER CHANCES OF GETTING NOTICED.<<

Well here's my story, lets see who cares.
I'm coming from euw. I spent 4 hours leveling an account to level 5 because posting here seems the only way I have even a slight chance to change something.

I have been banned before. I used to talk bad about people who wouldn't perform well or I would simply flame back. That was more than 12 months ago and back then i realized that I got banned twice because of it. And I became indifferent to most offenses I received, and I learned to accept that usually you can't change your teammates so I ended up not saying anything anymore. Only now and then would I actually try to point out someones mistakes (and i had learned that the only way to do so is by being polite) when I feel that it's a friendly team member I am talking to.

That was one year ago. I had minor breaks from league and I felt that even for myself im enjoying the games much more if I don't complain about my teammates - no matter am I flaming or polite.

Then, 10 months ago I got banned, I think it was for 7 days. I was REALLY upset. Because I dealt with the Summoner's Code after I got banned, I read it very carefully, and I actively tried to be a nice player. Back then you didn't see your report case, I could only guess, I assumed I've been banned for some bad games or maybe for one of the very rare cases I've had to quit a game (sometimes the internet might not work, like once every 500 games?). But I had to accept it.

For the past 10 months I've tried to encourage team members to ignore toxic players and have done so myself. I assumed that I was over those bans I couldn't explain. Even when once a very confusing team member started to talk lies on teamchat and kept telling people to report me (something like "hey stop walking into enemy tower you feed intentionally" - i wasn't doing that at all) - even then I didn't get banned. I'm not saying I'm the most polite person in the whole world but I'd say something offensive to a team member very, very rarely however almost every time there's a chance I say something like well done, wp, great juke etc. Even to my enemies.

That's why I was very confused to receive an email which said my account has been suspended for 14 days. It included the following link:

http://euw.leagueoflegends.com/tribu...e/521756/#nogo

Several things are quite disturbing:

Why do I get banned for 14 days? I've behaved really well - even according to the tribunal for a long time. Don't I deserve a lower punishment? I'm really scared of being close to perma ban now. I love this game I've invested a lot of time in it and I by all means I am trying to respect the rules.

How come a single person(per game) can report me for games I've been absolutely passive, in one I haven't even said anything, and people punish me for that?

I play a lot, I think I have about 2000 normal wins - I'm starting to wonder do people who play a lot end up more often at the tribunal because of "single angry person" bans? Afaik there's not much information on how the tribunal works exactly.

I've heard something about 20% of your games need to get you reported then you end up in tribunal. If that's true it would be awful for people who play much more than an average player - assuming that they are following the Code and are reported without justification they'd get reported with 5 cases at hand all the time. If the same kind of player would play 10 times less than that he'd maybe end up with 1-2 cases and it would be not as likely to get punished.

I would like to know is riots opinion really that it's sometimes ok to get someone banned simply because his teammates were angry for whatever reason, even if he played below average skill level merely because GENERALLY the tribunal works well? How is that justice.

inb4 "you said brainless" - come ON that's not something youd think deserves a ban, they didn't even complain about it and in all honesty, I sometimes take my time to point out an enemy has played badly - to either show that maybe we are not as strong as we thing or to raise morale. I can't remember did I call the enemy brainless, but I could have, prove otherwise.

inb4 "you fed your team lost because of you" -
Quote:

A15: When shall i punish feeders, when not?

Basicly, it is always your decision. Herefore remember, that the report reason is "intentionally" feeding and not just playing bad. Bad players are to be reported as bad player and not as feeder. Bad players are not guilty - you cant get banned cause you play bad!


Here's the short discussion I had on euw:

http://euw.leagueoflegends.com/board...d.php?t=967314

Reddit: http://redd.it/15h16i

Last words: This whole thing is so confusing. And frustrating. The tribunal is supposed to ban people as a disciplinary measure, right? What the hell am I supposed to learn from this. I'll get banned and won't know what I have done wrong or what I should have done. I won't know how to behave in the future.

Thanks for your time

__________________________________________________


UPDATE: Got reply for both tickets, almost at the same time.
The one submitted on EU West and "General" account section got a copy paste answer of no help.
The one submitted on NA with "Account Suspension" topic got a reply that asks me to provide further information about my account with the promise to look into it. Possibly also copy paste answer but I have the feeling the purpose behind it is actually looking into it.

UPDATE2: Second Support reply was the exact same copy paste. Proceeded to email Lyte. Tho no activity on his reddit for 10 days now I think it'll take a while until he's back to work. Still need to raise attention.

UPDATE3: A new Support Staff member replied, no useful information was given. Wondering what is the best way to proceed.

UPDATE4: lyte gave me a short reply about ban duration not being right and reduced by one level

UPDATE5(case solved):

Quote:

Hello Deain,

It's been some time and I just wanted to give you an update. We spent some time investigating this issue and were able to verify what you told. It's been considerable time since you were last punished by the Tribunal, however, your punishment level did not decay.

What we've done is gone in our back end and manually reduced your punishment level.

We also corrected the error itself which was preventing your real punishment level from applying. This means that for all intents and purposes your last Tribunal Action was a "warning" on your record.
Thats a very pleasant conclusion of my case.

Norwenna 12-17-2012 07:02 PM

I have same problem as you

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/en/case/6021905/

Great Pyrenees 12-17-2012 07:07 PM

Well first you were found guilty. But I am going to give you some advice. If you get killed early. Play really conservative. It never hurts to play carefully. If you want to test something out be extra careful. In 3 of 5 of your cases I would have punished for intentionally feeding.

Norwenna 12-17-2012 07:09 PM

it people like you that punish people for nothing that make the game bad for us

NynaeveaM 12-17-2012 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Great Pyrenees (Hozzászólás 32556556)
Well first you were found guilty. But I am going to give you some advice. If you get killed early. Play really conservative. It never hurts to play carefully. If you want to test something out be extra careful. In 3 of 5 of your cases I would have punished for intentionally feeding.

That's good advice but I already know that. Sometimes I get careless and feed but generally I'm reasonable. My concern however is that those cases on me are really spread thin among many games I've done. As I said I play a lot. It might seem that I feed in half the games even tho it's not true. Not that it would matter it's not against the code!

Sereg Anfaug 12-17-2012 07:13 PM

I'm one of the stricter judges in NA, and I really don't see why this case should recieve a Punish - your chat in all but the very last game is entirely inoffensive, and even in game 5, it's a very brief comment that's not repeated or elaborated on by anybody.

The scores are a bit bad, but I've had worse games, and if I'd played 2000 games, I'd have at least as many bad games as you did there.

Unless you're really toxic in the majority of your reported games, and somehow all five of the games that appeared in that case contained none of that, I really wonder why you ended up in the Tribunal at all.

The severity of your time ban is also really questionable. Assuming you're telling the truth about the 10 months between bans, I can't imagine how the punishment level hadn't decayed in that time.

I'd really like to see a Red post on this - I hope you get a satisfactory answer, and a reversal if that turns out to be in order.

NynaeveaM 12-17-2012 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sereg Anfaug (Hozzászólás 32556788)
I'm one of the stricter judges in NA, and I really don't see why this case should recieve a Punish - your chat in all but the very last game is entirely inoffensive, and even in game 5, it's a very brief comment that's not repeated or elaborated on by anybody.

The scores are a bit bad, but I've had worse games, and if I'd played 2000 games, I'd have at least as many bad games as you did there.

Unless you're really toxic in the majority of your reported games, and somehow all five of the games that appeared in that case contained none of that, I really wonder why you ended up in the Tribunal at all.

The severity of your time ban is also really questionable. Assuming you're telling the truth about the 10 months between bans, I can't imagine how the punishment level hadn't decayed in that time.

I'd really like to see a Red post on this - I hope you get a satisfactory answer, and a reversal if that turns out to be in order.

Thanks for the supportive reply - really something I needed to hear. Half of this threads purpose is fulfilled with that :)

About the 10 months - I checked my emails and I have an email from february 2012 where I wrote a ticket to support and I am not ENTIRELY sure was it already the 7 days ban or the 3 days ban. Could have been 2 months less so about 8. But definetly not shorter than that.

TenienDaithen 12-17-2012 07:25 PM

Have you contacted support? Maybe they can help.

This ****'s questionable, and I don't normally say that. Actually, I usually don't read posted cases on the forums because most of the people write some asinine post that makes me not even care if they were wrongly banned. You, on the other hand, have written a fine post and seem genuine.

NynaeveaM 12-17-2012 07:30 PM

Yea I wrote a ticket.
I was afraid that many people like you would think I'm just another person not realizing he flamed because it's normal for them and that few people would read this.

artofjet 12-17-2012 07:31 PM

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/en/case/6050232/ i called people noobs before and i have a friend named noob on my friends list... tribunal is run by people just pressing punish or whatever button you pressed. they dont bother reading the things. i just looked at case 4 for the thread maker, he didn't even say a word and got in trouble for that game. WTF!!


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