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-   -   So the best "supports" right now aren't support characters? (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2845068)

ratcharmer 11-28-2012 07:22 AM

So the best "supports" right now aren't support characters?
So I first off I haven't seen every game in every tournament. I'm just going off the ones I have seen.

In recent tournaments, and in play in general.it seems that the only 0-cs picks that are getting much love are Blitzcrank and Zyra. Heck, look at the Dreamhack finals-- 2 out of 3 games were Zyra versus Blitzcrank. The third game was Zyra versus Lulu, because Blitzcrank was banned.

In semifinals etc. I've seen a few other picks, but even in those the characters designed to help a team mate seemed to be falling short versus fighters, mages etc.

At the overseas IEM tournament I saw Sona played in the semifinals, but even though her team won it was clearly a win in spite of Sona, not because of her. Bottom lane lost, at least in part due to the fact that every single time a fight broke out Sona died almost instantly.

So is it just that my sampling of the games worked out that way? Has anyone else been noticing this?

I'm hoping that the item & mastery rework (yay!) might make some of the help-your-allies champions more viable . . . but now I'm not so sure . . .

I was originally thinking that the upcoming pickpocket mastery might help out Janna, Lulu, Soraka etc. since a ranged harass character will get more benefit from said mastery then a tanky melee.
HOWEVER, the conclusion I've heard so far is that in the new patch the 0-cs position will generally have more gp to spend, and the champions designed to aid others have absolutely terrible scaling, whereas the fighters/mages etc who are finding their way to the position actually scale pretty well.

I guess at this point the only option really is to wait and see. Still excited about this patch, but I do think we're going to see certain champions go extinct soon unless they get a major buff.

EDIT: I wanted to make something clear that may not have been in the original post--I have no problem with Zyra & Blitzcrank being viable in the 0-cs role. In fact that's probably a net positive. What I do have a problem with is that there's an entire category of champions who are rapidly losing viability in any role whatsoever.

BrickRocket 11-28-2012 07:24 AM

it's not the support's fault that their class gets constantly nerfed into the ground by riot.

MeekNA 11-28-2012 07:26 AM

soraka was antifun cos randoms couldn't press qwer and kill someone so morello nerf her.
shield/heal on every support is a good concept, riot logic.
tanky dps is even a better concept.

JGVariety 11-28-2012 07:27 AM

Man Support Zyras are such a pain :/

imweasel09 11-28-2012 07:28 AM

Since when does blitzcrank not count as a support? He hasn't really been able to jungle effectively or lane anywhere else for over a year now. On top of that he was considered a terrible support until soraka/janna/sona got nerfed into making kill supports like blitz and leona viable again.

I swear, people complained forever "BOT LANE TOO PASSIVE WAAAH, SORAKA CAUSES FARM LANE FOREVER" and riot finally makes aggressive supports viable and everyone loses their head.

cocacolalips 11-28-2012 07:28 AM

They play OP champions, regardless of their role.

What does this mean? Better nerf Zyra and Blitzcrank.

Soon enough we will see Jax bottom lane with 0cs. kkk

Outworld 11-28-2012 07:28 AM

Support LeBlanc..

Seriously, build her a philo stone and then go off-AP starting with a mejais. If you don't get stacks, oh well, it's a little AP but you're a support, you're not expected to stomp. The passive from the philo--stone also reduces the possible loss of gold if you can't seem to reach 5 stacks, which you definitely will surpass in mid game given your ability to escape. If you do get stacks, the other team can have fun building negatrons while your top and carry rip their hearts out, dice them into small chunks, and then feed them to wives! Olaf is especially good at this.

It is more-or-less a pub pick right now, but in the future, who knows? (I have a friend with 850 wins who mains LeBlanc mid exclusively apart from his Fizz mid games, and he plays LB support all the time and does surprising well)
It's also really fun and it will get your mind off of Riot's current disinterest in going anywhere with supports. Nami is cool, but she, as a champion, won't fix the support scene.

With that being said, I like kill supports much more than the traditional support, I just don't like it when people play a champion and go bot with the AD just so they can play the champion, regardless of role. I am OK with the current supports being played right now. It's changing the game. This sort of change is OK. The game is no less good or no better than it was a year ago in terms of its entertainment value.

When I play against Zyra or Blitz, my positioning must be perfect, therefore I have to concentrate more on it than zoning or farming. This changes how I play. It adds more depth to bot lane, which used to be Carry/SustainSupport vs Carry/SustainSupport in a mechanics battle until the jungler came.... boring. Mechanics are very cool, but just going military robot drone mode to farm for 15-20 minutes whilst nothing else happening can be a bit tedious for some and is boring to watch.

It makes you a better player in the end, even if you don't realize it.

Iscaria 11-28-2012 07:29 AM

Riot and Morello philosophy: If it works, break it.

AA247 11-28-2012 07:31 AM

that because zyra and bliz are op? zyra's lvl 2 poke if she gets the snare is about half ur health. 1 good bliz pull= gg.

Showdwn 11-28-2012 07:32 AM

Because Morello hates supports but would never nerf one of his precious mages.

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