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-   -   Reformed rager looking for assistance (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2630387)

Notorious P I P 10-01-2012 05:51 PM

Reformed rager looking for assistance
So the past month or so i have been really into actually getting better at the game. I fell to the 700 elo status mainly by not being a good teammate and raging pretty hard on occassion. I have managed to get myself up over 850 and am starting to play better, but watching the higher elo people play their are still some things about the game i am not picking up.

That is where my question lies. I unddrstand i need to last hit better so that is something I practice a lot. About more advanced tactics and the such where would i find good guides or videos to help me gain a better understanding. Watching the tourneys only does so much and the random videos could be made my anyone. Im looking for some good information to help me get better.

I found that i enjoy this game a lot more since ive stopped the rage and thank you all in advance for any help you can give me.

Notorious P I P 10-02-2012 08:54 AM

actually found some good videos of theoddone jungling with random champs but he has some pretty good commentary that opened my eyes to a few things. Thanks anyway guys.

Bravest Leader 10-02-2012 09:19 AM


Amatzikahni 10-02-2012 09:54 AM

As I've gotten better, certain things have become common sense to me. I'm still only high silver/low gold, but many games I do find myself leading the team because others don't understand some of these things.

First, always weigh the pros and cons of what you're doing against what you could be doing. This used to be very difficult for me, but as I've gotten better, I've started to think about the overall progression of the game and potential teamfights/objectives while I almost subconsciously move my own character. If your team is down and the enemy jungle/mid/bot is at dragon, should your team stick around and try to steal/teamfight it or should they continue to farm/push their lanes/jungle to try and recoup some of that lost XP/gold? What about if you're up? How about ganking top and downing that tower while they drag? Many players around my Elo tend to group up at dragon even when I know we can't win a direct confrontation, and when the jungler goes in to steal, everyone charges in blindly and gives them 3-4 kills on top of their dragon. That's just one example, but realize that the entire time they're dealing dragon, you don't have to be standing around doing nothing and waiting for them to snowball; weigh the pros and cons of what you're doing and what you could be doing.

Second, realize the potential of global vs local advantages. Many players tend to play a certain way regardless of how the map looks. Very frequently I'm able to take advantage of this fact and dominate my opponent or win objectives because I have more map awareness than they do. For example, say that your jungler is doing the buff closest to Dragon and you see their jungler on the map from top's river ward. Your jungler can go start dragon and have mid/bot come help and if the enemies try to stop it, you can win the 4v3 because the enemy jungler is too far away. That's local advantage—you have the advantage in numbers and, assuming nobody's fed, that difference is decisive. Also don't forget about global advantage. If your mid opponent ran away to gank bot, your teammates will have lost the local tactical advantage (it's 2v3 at bot lane), but you can keep the global advantage by pushing hard and downing their mid turret and providing your entire team with gold from the downed tower while forcing them to waste gold on extra wards to keep the area secure. You could counter-gank, too, and if you succeed, you can down bot turret and then grab drag to provide your top lane with lots of extra gold to help him secure a win there. Balancing local and global advantage is the key principle separating 2500+ Elo team leaders from other high Elo players, but it's very noticeable at every level of play and can definitely help you to picture the overall game.

Third, keep objectives in mind. The primary objective is to kill the enemy's nexus. If you win a fight and there's only one opponent left, explain to yourself why chasing them for 30+ seconds and having to base (because you lost so much health tanking a turret) is worth it. What will that extra ~300 gold do for you? Will it help you to win the next teamfight? What if you miss them and don't secure the kill? You've just wasted very valuable time because their team can't do anything. What you need to do in this circumstance is push towers. Pushing towers gives your team global gold, local XP, and helps get you closer to downing their nexus. After downing a few turrets, go grab Baron before they can stop you and now you really can't lose the next fight. What about when your top leaves lane to go grab drag? Should you worry that you're going to lose top turret? The truth is, after you get drag (which is worth more than an outer turret), your team can 5v4 or 5v3 either mid or bot turret and win that turret as well thereby winning the map control fight. As long as you know what gives your team the most advantage, playing for the advantage gives your team the best shot at winning.

That's the end of my post, but I'll conclude with an example from one of my games. We were purple and I was Taric. It was about 25-30 minutes into the game and their top outer turret was still up. I know that, this late in the game, outer turrets deal insignificant damage to your tanks (which Taric is at this point) so teamfighting under one is only a slight disadvantage. However, I saw that their Lee popped up on the map near our second Mid turret trying to push it with a minion wave. Instantly I told my team to initiate while I blew Shurelya's, Flash, and Ult. Our team won the fight 4-1 (I tanked the turret and ate all the CC so I died) but combining our ADC with a tank and an AP, we ended up downing their inhib before Lee could down our inner turret. Afterward, our team went back to base to buy and ended up catching them trying a Baron and the game was over. If I didn't know about local advantage (the fight being 5v4 without their tank) or about objective control (he was free-downing mid/inner turrets while we were dancing around their outer turret), I probably would have told the team to rush back and stop him, but I knew these things and made the play to win the game for my team.

If you're looking for character specific advanced plays, then either watching high-level replays or spectating them would give you the best results, but understanding why they make the decisions that they do is much less clear, so I explained a bit of their reasoning to help you out.

Valrcrist 10-02-2012 11:20 AM


As I've gotten better, certain things have become common sense to me. I'm still only high silver/low gold, but many games I do find myself leading the team because others don't understand some of these things.
This is HUGE. Honestly the entire post has great information, but it's too long to quote all of it. There are a couple things I'd like to add though.

1) Not only think about global objectives/the point of the game instead of just focusing on your own lane, but communicate with your team. Communication is absolutely necessary. I'm actually somewhat of the opinion that support is the second best role to carry yourself with (the first being jungler), because of the fact that you're in one of the best positions to keep an eye on the whole map. A lot of the time when laning it's easy to get tunnel visioned on your own lane, so even if you have warded, you might miss the jungler walking through it, or the fact that another lane is MIA. As the support, you can keep an eye on all of this and let your team know what's going on. Doing this a few times not only can save your teammates from death, it puts you in a position of authority and gets them used to listening to you. If you show yourself to make good calls, people will notice. The other reason I think that jungle and support are the best roles to carry yourself is my second point actually.

2) Wards. Wards EVERYWHERE. Vision wins games, hands down. Even if you're losing, you'd be surprised at how often you'll see the other team completely split, which means that you can start picking people off when they're separated from the group, getting your team easy kills and starting to make a comeback. Sometimes you can catch a team doing Baron, and get an Ace from it, or realize that your team is grouped up towards top while their team is doing Dragon, which means that YOU can Baron if it's late enough in the game. Knowing what the other team is doing is absolutely invaluable, in all parts of the game. In laning phase it's hard as a support to really ward past Dragon, but you should ALWAYS have wards on you, and once laning phase ends, ward everywhere. As a jungler, since you're roaming around the map, you can help ward in the enemy jungle and just generally around the map. On the flip side of things, I'm a big advocate of getting an early Oracle's as the jungler, since this will let you completely clear out enemy wards, and denying the other team vision is HUGE.

3) Remember that this is a team game. This is something that I notice a lot, and I think it's the number one reason that people complain about elo hell. It seems like once someone wins their lane, they think that they've become rambo, and can just 1v5 the enemy team. You really can't do that. If you're dominating so hard, all you're doing by manmoding in is giving the other team the opportunity to kill you off. Even if you aren't dominating your lane, you can't get caught, getting caught loses games. This ties into the above point about warding, as vision means you know where the enemy team is, and are less likely to get caught out as a result

4) Know your role. By this I don't mean "Oh I'm top lane", although it is useful to know the differences between each lane, I mean, you have to know what your job is in teamfights. Regardless of which lane they're in, different champs play in different ways. For example, if you're Olaf, your job in teamfights (assuming that the rest of your team is ready to follow up as well), is to pop ghost + ult and just bullet into the enemy squishies. For most of the game, Olaf has incredible duelling capability even when building tanky, so you want to just get into the fight and blow up a squishy and do as much general damage/cause as much disruption as possible. On Vlad on the other hand, you don't want to go for any particular person necessarily, you just want to get off a good ult, get into the middle of the enemy team, and do as much AoE damage as possible with tides of blood/sanguine pool. Both of these champs are fairly popular top laners but they play in very different ways and have very different jobs in teamfights.

5) Know how to build your champion. This seems like a fairly minor one, but you would be amazed at how many incredibly stupid builds I see for common champions. Part of knowing how to build is also knowing how to counterbuild not only your lane opponent, but also the enemy team in general. For example, if you're playing someone like jungle skarner, who wants to be tanky, you need to look at the enemy team and see who's the most fed. If that Ryze in mid is fed, you'll want to build something like a Force of Nature first, for the MR. If that Graves bot is fed, then going Frozen Heart first is your best bet. Build to counter your enemy.

Notorious P I P 10-06-2012 02:12 AM

Hsy tha.ks a lot guys. Got up over 900 so thats 200 elo boost the past couple weeks. I dont dominate or anything but i have a lot better games. Even when my team loses i do not generally do bad. I think my downfall right now is that i am too much of a team player. I play all roles so there is no rage when people demand one but it isnt allowing me to get better at anything specific.

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