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-   -   AD or AP Shaco? (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=1965111)

inFe eD 03-30-2012 11:55 AM

AD or AP Shaco?
 
Shaco's one of my go-to guys when I figure I just want to relax and have a fun game, because he is very effective when not countered and simply a blast to play. There's a reason he was one of my mains on SR, and that's because of the mindgames he can play on the enemy team when played well. I've had success with both AD and AP Shaco, my win rate is about equal with both. They perform different roles and need to be played very differently, but are both equally viable imo, since he's almost as hard to catch as Kassadin is, maybe harder if you take into account that all 4 of his abilities can be used to distract/disjoint in some way.

So my question was, what builds have you guys found effective for him, for either playstyle? My builds for both hasn't really changed since I started playing him; the builds I first imagined being effective remain so today. If anyone's curious, they're:

AD - Boots, Prospector's, Mobility Boots, Brutalizer, Vamp Scepter, Ghostblade/Infinity Edge depending on farm, Adapt

AP - Ionian Boots, Morello's Tome, Lichbane, Deathcap, Adapt

Just wanted to see what other builds Shaco players find effective (Guinsoo + Gunblade Hybrid Shaco sucks, by the way).


.

GrignardTS 03-30-2012 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inFe eD (Hozzászólás 22594329)

Just wanted to see what other builds Shaco players find effective (Guinsoo + Gunblade Hybrid Shaco sucks, by the way).
.

This one time, at band camp, a Shaco in my team went BOM, Ionic Spark, Rageblade, Gunblade in that order. He was top.

We lost, he got first, blamed us.

I lol'd

On topic, the only Shaco that is worth playing is AD. Yes, AP can work. You can win with AP. But he's just so much better AD.

Basist 03-30-2012 12:07 PM

If you're going AP, Deathfire is much better than Morello. Just placing boxes and throwing shivs isn't enough: the active actually gives you decent burst. As for AD, it's all mix and match.

I find Mobility to be the most useless boots for Shaco because: 1.) When the fight rolls around you are stuck at 2 move speed without any other benefits from the other boots, and 2.) The time it takes to get the speed bonus back makes it not worth it because you are supposed to be jumping in and out of fights.

Triforce is a great item for AD Shaco because it gives him all the movespeed he needs and makes Deceive/Two Shiv+backstab combo very deadly. I find that a squishy Shaco is not that helpful because all you can do is stay in the fight for a few seconds max while their bruiser/tank just ignores you. It's all down to playstyle and preference really, but I always get Shaco some survivability by the third completed item.

My AD builds would go something like: Mercs/Zerks, Triforce, IE, Youmou's, then depending on their team: Sanguine, Frozen Mallet, Sunfire, Wits End, Black Cleaver, or Odyns Veil.

For AP depending on team I get: Ionian/Sorc, Deathfire, Rabadon, Rylai, Lichbane, then whatever to counter the enemy team with: Abyssal, Void, or Hourglass.

Like I've said it's all down to preference and what your style of play is, but I've found the items I listed as the most effective for myself.



I don't like to play straight AD or AP Shaco, I always play Activateable Item Shaco. Deathfire+Gunblade actives as first two items gives you decent auto damage, good ap, cdr, lifesteal, spell vamp, and lastly but most importantly two damage actives on top of Two Shiv for amazing burst.

GrignardTS 03-30-2012 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Basist (Hozzászólás 22594584)
I find Mobility to be the most useless boots for Shaco because:

I disagree because:

You play Shaco for jungle control. This is achieved by boxing and moving fast enough through the jungle to do so.

You also play him to 1v1 others. Catching opponents out of position and alone: You need to get to them fast.

You also need to be ganking bot constantly. And you better not let it be a 3v4 top. Get back to top fast.

Back door? Need to be fast.

Basist 03-30-2012 12:15 PM

^ If you play Shaco as a back capper and stacking boxes all around the map, sure go for mobility. I usually get Triforce/Lichbane by my fourth item so having over 420 movespeed is good enough for me. All I'm saying is *every* game where the Shaco on my team gets mobility we've lost. If you want to take them sure, knock yourself out but I personally think they're trash.

GrignardTS 03-30-2012 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Basist (Hozzászólás 22594789)
^ If you play Shaco as a back capper and stacking boxes all around the map, sure go for mobility. I usually get Triforce/Lichbane by my fourth item so having over 420 movespeed is good enough for me. All I'm saying is *every* game where the Shaco on my team gets mobility we've lost. If you want to take them sure, knock yourself out but I personally think they're trash.

You don't 'play shaco as a back capper and stack boxes'

You play Shaco, you back cap sometimes because he's 2nd only to Rammus at it, you box the jungle for vision and to prevent ganks, and you also help your team in team fights by assaulting/defending points.

In order to do all of that, you need to be fast.

I assure you that the 25% AS, 25 MR+Tenacity, or 15% CDR isn't going to make you magically an amazing Shaco.

inFe eD 03-30-2012 12:21 PM

What really sold mobility for me for AD Shaco is that you keep the movespeed bonus when you deceive. A large part of AD shaco is positioning behind a squishy's back so your initial crit takes out a large chunk of their HP. I haven't achieved similar results with any of the other booties.

I also disagree with you saying AP Shaco is less effective than AD, it's just a lot harder to play, and a lot harder to see the impact he's having on the game. Gradually wearing down the enemy team with boxes and shivs is a lot easier to miss than AD shaco critting a squishy for half their HP. I generally find that's why I get blamed for our team's loss a lot more if I'm AP rather than AD, even if my performance is about the same.

Hugs From Momma 03-30-2012 12:22 PM

AD.

Playing AP Shaco is basically a 4v5 past the 5 minute mark. Everyone builds merc treads, one or two MR items and your threat goes to 0.

Sauron 03-30-2012 12:23 PM

I prefer my clowns with lots of swords and blades, not nerdy books and wands.

GrignardTS 03-30-2012 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inFe eD (Hozzászólás 22594950)
Gradually wearing down the enemy team with boxes and shivs is a lot easier to miss than AD shaco critting a squishy for half their HP.

But this is the reason why its not as good.

Because in such a fast paced game, we don't have time for AP Shaco to nest boxes and slowly chip someone with Shiv.

We need those back caps/ganks/assaults now. Right now.

Again, its not bad. Its just not as good as AD.


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