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-   -   Taunt and Joke Spam (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=123347)

MercuryRed 05-29-2010 12:37 AM

Taunt and Joke Spam
 
Please, please put taunt spam back into the game.

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...d.php?t=120950

If you have not looked at this, PLEASE DO SO NOW.
Over 200 people have signed this petition. I just want to know why you guys fixed something that wasn't broken. It was one of the best "silly" items in the game, and broke the ice between teams.

Or if you refuse to un-fix it, please tell us your reasoning!

Thank you very much.

-Red

iNsAyNe 05-29-2010 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercuryRed (Hozzászólás 1424324)

Or if you refuse to un-fix it, please tell us your reasoning!

Thank you very much.

-Red

No, we demand it to be reverted.

Monkits 05-31-2010 08:31 PM

Argeed.

RiotJay 06-01-2010 11:50 AM

Hey MercuryRed,

Thanks for bringing this up on the audio forums! There are multiple reasons why emote spam was removed, some from the audio side and some from other departments. I can't speak directly for the other departments, but I can quote a response from content producer Jeff Jew on the higher level, community reasons...

Quote:

Originally Posted by RiotJeffJew (Hozzászólás 1436016)
It's just not fun for everyone - sure, it's amusing for some, but for a new user who joins the game and gets spammed to death, it's a griefing method.

From an audio perspective there are a number of reasons, but the biggest one is game performance. Unlike sound effects for spells, which are loaded into memory so they can be recalled quickly and often, character VO has to be directly streamed from your disc. This helps us not only reduce load time, but also controls the size of the memory footprint our game requires.

The negative side of streaming from the disk is that is uses more CPU to actually pull audio from the disk every time it uses it. This isn't an issue for things like unit responses that happen infrequently, but when audio is pulled off the disk repeatedly in very short periods of time, it begins to affect the performance of the overall game. When multiple users were spamming different emotes, it was causing a drop in FPS across all but top notch machines, and made the game almost unplayable on lower level machines we tested on. We want to respect the ingame experience of all our users, and are very wary of giving users the ability to so greatly effect the performance and experience of other users.

Another negative audio affect that arises from spamming emotes is something we dubbed 'sound tearing.' The basic idea is that we are limited in the number of channels we can play audio through, and when this max number is reached we have a priority system in place that decides which sounds to play and which ones to temporarily mute until a channel is available. Under normal circumstances, the number of channels is manageable, and only small, unnoticeable things such as torches and minions attacks are denied audio channels. A problem arises though, when multiple users spam emotes, as they take up channels and cause higher and higher priority sounds begin to lose channels. The result is that loud, noticeable audio (such as spells and buffs) begins cutting in a out very rapidly, causing very staticy pops that are pretty painful to here even when playing the game at reasonable volumes.

These are the two main audio issues that arise from emote spamming. I'm happy to go into some of the smaller reasons if anyone is interested, or clarify anything in this post if anyone has further questions (or are just interested in how audio for video games!)

We're always happy to get feedback from the community, and the audio team will be responding on this thread if you guys would like to keep a healthy discussion on the topic going.

DragonArmy 06-01-2010 12:54 PM

I appreciated the change to no spamming allowed. Especially when it could be used to lower FPS (i played against a guy that binded it to a key so that he could spam it). It is always fun to remember the "good old days," but spamming was so annoying. I 100% RIOT not bringing it back.

k0b3 CleoFairy 06-01-2010 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaywatford (Hozzászólás 1453229)
Hey MercuryRed,

Thanks for bringing this up on the audio forums! There are multiple reasons why emote spam was removed, some from the audio side and some from other departments. I can't speak directly for the other departments, but I can quote a response from content producer Jeff Jew on the higher level, community reasons...



From an audio perspective there are a number of reasons, but the biggest one is game performance. Unlike sound effects for spells, which are loaded into memory so they can be recalled quickly and often, character VO has to be directly streamed from your disc. This helps us not only reduce load time, but also controls the size of the memory footprint our game requires.

The negative side of streaming from the disk is that is uses more CPU to actually pull audio from the disk every time it uses it. This isn't an issue for things like unit responses that happen infrequently, but when audio is pulled off the disk repeatedly in very short periods of time, it begins to affect the performance of the overall game. When multiple users were spamming different emotes, it was causing a drop in FPS across all but top notch machines, and made the game almost unplayable on lower level machines we tested on. We want to respect the ingame experience of all our users, and are very wary of giving users the ability to so greatly effect the performance and experience of other users.

Another negative audio affect that arises from spamming emotes is something we dubbed 'sound tearing.' The basic idea is that we are limited in the number of channels we can play audio through, and when this max number is reached we have a priority system in place that decides which sounds to play and which ones to temporarily mute until a channel is available. Under normal circumstances, the number of channels is manageable, and only small, unnoticeable things such as torches and minions attacks are denied audio channels. A problem arises though, when multiple users spam emotes, as they take up channels and cause higher and higher priority sounds begin to lose channels. The result is that loud, noticeable audio (such as spells and buffs) begins cutting in a out very rapidly, causing very staticy pops that are pretty painful to here even when playing the game at reasonable volumes.

These are the two main audio issues that arise from emote spamming. I'm happy to go into some of the smaller reasons if anyone is interested, or clarify anything in this post if anyone has further questions (or are just interested in how audio for video games!)

We're always happy to get feedback from the community, and the audio team will be responding on this thread if you guys would like to keep a healthy discussion on the topic going.


I never thought about that before. Granted it's way more technical than I'd even dream of imagining. But that you for the clear response.

Golduck 06-01-2010 05:35 PM

Thanks for the clear response but you still need to put it back into the game.

Simply put; Up the minimum requirements for CPU performance or provide the tech that allows it to run.

I have never heard of a player complaining about sound performance or CPU performance when taunt spamming happened. You are explaining the tech behind how it works but it doesn't correlate into real world problems.

Just what exactly are the specs for these "low-end" computers you tested it on, and how many players actually have computers in this category?



The audio that is looping is not audio overlapping. So the same amount of channels for the voice command are being used when spammed or not. At maximum this is 10 channels. Audio tearing really sounds unfounded.


I would like to see user complaints or at least the data on user complaints about this "sound tearing." I have never encountered the problem before, and I doubt it's impact on the game performance.

iNsAyNe 06-01-2010 06:06 PM

Jay Watford, Thank you for telling us the reasons for taking emote looping out of the game.

I believe now is the time for you to begin talking about how you will work towards putting the feature back into the game.

Thanks,

REDHAMMER

RiotJay 06-01-2010 06:20 PM

@Golduck: Thanks very much for your reply. If you'd like to look at the thread where users brought up 'sound tearing' as we call it (though everyone has their own description of the resulting audio), please visit this one..

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...ad.php?t=18783

You are very correct about the audio looping and not overlapping, the problem arises from the fact that the spamming encourages multiple users to activate the emotes repeatedly at the same time, for instance at the end of the game. As it stands, having the emotes play to the end with a slight cooldown seems to help control channel numbers and keeps people from creating the spam that causes the problem.

If you'd like an example of a user complaining about its impact on game performance, please look at DragonArmy's post, which is directly below mine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Golduck (Hozzászólás 1456567)
Simply put; Up the minimum requirements for CPU performance or provide the tech that allows it to run.

This is a decision that is far beyond the audio team's jurisdiction, so I can't really comment on it.

iNsAyNe 06-01-2010 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaywatford (Hozzászólás 1457027)
@Golduck: Thanks very much for your reply. If you'd like to look at the thread where users brought up 'sound tearing' as we call it (though everyone has their own description of the resulting audio), please visit this one..

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board...ad.php?t=18783


If you'd like an example of a user complaining about its impact on game performance, please look at DragonArmy's post, which is directly below mine.

Thanks for the fast response.

As the tech was already in place to be able to spam, why not just provide an option in-game that allows the feature to be turned off or on if it is causing FPS problems? You would make an both sides of the debate happy with such a choice.

After all, there are multiple options regarding graphics performance which can be customized to a players setup and PC capability. Why give the sound the short end of the stick and one-track it's presence in the game?


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