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-   -   How to survive Ryze's Ult (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=12243)

Bianary 09-16-2009 08:15 PM

How to survive Ryze's Ult
 
This is a repost from a different thread about reworking Ryze's ult, but I figured people would like to actually be able to find it since I see this topic come up quite often.

I'm tired of people saying "Ryze is OP you can't survive his ult." That's false. This guide post about your options when Ryze ults should hold true unless/until he gets a rework that modifies how his ult behaves.

This is specifically on how to survive his ult, I don't have a lot of tips for surviving a well built Ryze's Q lategame (General magic resistance, health, and harassing him/not letting him get kills tends to shut that down decently because he's not a great farmer and needs AP and mana to get deadly - so if he doesn't get ganks, he won't build up very well) Please note that none of these options are supposed to be usable every time -- it's a matter of knowing what you can do, and selecting the most likely one to work for your given situation. Also of note, Ryze is a strong anti-melee carry (Due to rune prison shutting down auto-attacks) so in some cases you may simply be forced to leave him alone and go fight other enemies instead.

Here are your options to deal with his ult:
  • Before the game starts:
    • Bring Cleanse as your summoner skill if you really get killed by Ryze and want some time alive to figure him out. Using it immediately when he moves in to ult will help teach you the ult's range and how far you have to get to survive it. This is the best summoner spell to help you survive against Ryze 1v1. Even if you don't fight Ryze, Cleanse is a valuable escape (And attack at times) spell so it's rarely bad to have along.
  • Before he gets close:
    • Stay near your creeps, so his ult is more likely to bounce off among them than to keep bouncing between you and him.
    • Stay a bit away from any allied champion in the area in case Ryze pops out of nowhere and ults. Setting him up so all he has to do is ult to kill both of you is your own fault. This also sets it up so if Ryze shows up and tries to gank one of you, the other can have a good shot at killing him while he's getting in range.
    • Stay near jungle creeps if you're in a bad spot in the jungle (What are you doing there with Ryze mia anyway? That's bad play.)
    • Buy appropriate armor if you find yourself unable to avoid his ult setups. A banshee's veil along with another strong defensive item (either MGR or hp) will provide enough defense to survive an ult from anything short of an overfed Ryze. Do not rely on the spellshield from banshee's, but be aware that it will inconvenience Ryze as he has to use either his root or one of his two damage abilities (And ideally he wants both his Q and his ult to ensure the kill) to take it down. This will make him easier to harass.
  • If he rune prisons you:
    • Snare him and run. If he ults after you'll get out of range and it will fizzle out.
    • Stun him and run (Or just kill him, if he's weak)
    • Cleanse rune prison and retreat if you have no other option to shut down his ult.
    • Flash away from him after he launches his ult and it bounces once, it will fizzle on him. Note that flashing before it hits you will result in it chasing to your new location, and possibly setting up bounces between you and your allies there. Again, panic is the #1 killer of people getting hit by Ryze's ult.
    • Knock him away, jump, activate a +defense ult, etc. if your champion has any of these abilities. Remember, you can use almost all abilities inside of rune prison (Trynd's spin and possibly Mino's headbutt can't be used, I'm not certain if there are others).
    • Click to run if you have nothing else, if Ryze stops to launch Q before his ult you'll often (Especially early game) have plenty of time to get his ult to extreme range and that will cause it to fizzle rather than bouncing. Even without him stopping to launch Q, early game you can often escape his ult just by immediately running directly away from him if he's rune prisoned you at the edge of his casting range.
  • If he kills you with his ult:
    • Harass him hard because he doesn't have his protection anymore for a bit.
    • Call an immediate gank for the same reason as the previous point.
  • If he's weak and getting his AP bonus
    • Stun him or open with an overwhelming strike of your own. Ryze is fragile hp-wise, if he launches his rune prison do not panic because you can still use your skills - just kill him, he's weak. Panic when prisoned against a weak Ryze is an extremely good way to die, and newbie players do it all the time.
    • Get an ally and gank him. Once he's dead his ult stops bouncing.
    • Don't let him lure you into a turret or other source of protection, strike him when he presses forward. If he's hiding behind his turret, he's not a threat to you right then.
  • If he has an ally:
    • Keep them both at range (Certain champions have long enough range attacks to do this)
    • Get an ally of your own that can shut Ryze down if he moves for a kill. 2v1 is very bad regardless of the opponents.
    • Ensure you have anti-cc available as the other ally can set Ryze up too.
    • Remember that 2v1 against Ryze is no worse than a 2v1 against Blitzcrank, you're likely dead if you make a single mistake in either case - that's not a sign of an OP champion, it's just a nasty duo of which there are many.
I'm sure there are other ways to deal with him that I've forgotten, but suffice to say if you play against Ryze rather than simply trying to play the same way you would any other champion, he can be dealt with and shut down very effectively.

I will edit this post if anyone can point out why a strategy is entirely ineffective (Or extremely situational such that it shouldn't even be considered) or for options I missed.

Edit: Thanks to Laggy for pointing out Cleanse's effectiveness at surviving Ryze's ult long enough to learn its range. Also of note, any strange wordings are my fault.

SmecssRaege 09-16-2009 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bianary (Hozzászólás 125674)
  • Before the game starts:
    • Bring Cleanse as your summoner skill if you really get killed by Ryze and want some time alive to figure him out. Using it immediately when he moves in to ult will help teach you the ult's range and how far you have to get to survive it. This is the best summoner spell to help you survive against Ryze 1v1. Even if you don't fight Ryze, Cleanse is a valuable escape (And attack at times) spell so it's rarely bad to have along.



I read about as far as that... and then laughed and couldn't go on (as i know perfectly well how to not die to ryze at this point)

Because what this post assumes is that you are psychic and know they have a ryze before the hero matchup screen even shows up.

seresibyl 09-16-2009 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmecssRaege (Hozzászólás 125814)
[/list] [/list]

I read about as far as that... and then laughed and couldn't go on (as i know perfectly well how to not die to ryze at this point)

Because what this post assumes is that you are psychic and know they have a ryze before the hero matchup screen even shows up.

I think it was meant to be like, if you really really really fear Ryze, then always use Cleanse. It's nice to have anyways!

TombMonkey 09-16-2009 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmecssRaege (Hozzászólás 125814)
[/list] [/list]

I read about as far as that... and then laughed and couldn't go on (as i know perfectly well how to not die to ryze at this point)

Because what this post assumes is that you are psychic and know they have a ryze before the hero matchup screen even shows up.

As things look in whatever elo I am; there's about a 75% chance that there will be a Ryze.

Bianary 09-16-2009 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seresibyl (Hozzászólás 125826)
I think it was meant to be like, if you really really really fear Ryze, then always use Cleanse. It's nice to have anyways!

That's exactly what it is, thank you for pointing it out to SmecssRaege. Especially as I did say exactly what you're saying in the paragraph recommending Cleanse (That it will almost always be useful even without an enemy Ryze, so if you are really afraid of him it's a good idea)

evyugi 09-16-2009 11:25 PM

Get Banshee, kill him if you are dpser or run to some teammate. If he was smart and used overload before prison because he know u got banshee, so you still got prisoned, flash away, now go kill him.

SmecssRaege 09-16-2009 11:25 PM

Oh i perfectly understood the reasoning behind it =P

I was just trying to point out the general wording of it through my own internpretation i guess :P

All in all i was just trying to make a little joke about it >.>;

And yes, cleanse is epic....and 150ish games under me... i'd say thre frequency of ryze (in my personal experience) is (a) been on a large decline in the last week and (b) is probbaly only about 20-25% or so ... but that could just be my personal experience in the heroes im facing =p

Bianary 09-16-2009 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmecssRaege (Hozzászólás 125969)
And yes, cleanse is epic....and 150ish games under me... i'd say thre frequency of ryze (in my personal experience) is (a) been on a large decline in the last week and (b) is probbaly only about 20-25% or so ... but that could just be my personal experience in the heroes im facing =p

I think the ELO bracket you're in really influences it, I haven't seen a Ryze in ages but I used to all the time (I started AT'ing more, which would bump my ELO up a bit just from being in a premade)

Also, this has to be one of the most-asked questions about a specific champion (Or threads saying Ryze is OP and it can't be survived) that I've seen in the forums, and assuming Ryze isn't getting reworked this patch (I think Ryze is staying the same for now) this will hopefully be of use to people who are having trouble surviving his ult. I've seen bits and pieces of the list I put together go by in other threads, but not all in one spot like this -- which is why I welcome any useful tips that I missed and will add them in, to help this be as useful as it can be.

Pércival 09-17-2009 09:17 AM

Saw this post in the other topic.
it is fantastic.

09-17-2009 10:26 AM

Yeah, Ryze does pop up a lot in the lower to mid ELO's. I think mine's been going up recently from a winning streak/AT, so I haven't really seen him as much now. Cleanse is a good summoner spell to take regardless of there being a Ryze though; it just makes it all the better when they do have a Ryze.


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