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@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 02:04 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
30 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by exec3 View Post
No questions answered. ;-;

Morello what do you think the chances of Wukong's original clone kit being released today? Would it still be too complicated a design or would its niche be acceptable now with so many champions out.
I think the controls are still out-of-bounds, but the gameplay is not.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 02:03 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
29 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by hashinshin View Post
also wait, THAT'S what you respond to? Not the lifesteal quint nerfs? Not the feral druid? None of the booing?

If the lifesteal quints nerf goes live I will be very disappointed with Riot balance.

The lifsteal quint nerfs are what this very thread is about. Unresponsable nerfing. The kind of nerfing that makes me go MORELLO YOU'RE JUST STRENGTHENING RENEKTON WHILE NERFING MORE TOP LANERS MORELLO STOP PLEASE MORELLO WHY?
It's a reminder how much I need better centralized decision-making on balance, because I have low insight into the lifesteal rune nerfs :P That's my bad though.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 02:02 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
28 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralik098 View Post
It isn't for you to decide, that is for the players to decide. Champion selection should be decided by player preference, not whoever Riot deems "the lesser of multiple evils". The sooner you learn this the better off the game will be.

The fact that you are openly admitting to leaving Renekton op in order to shove others out of the game is just disgusting. Your massive bias towards these champions that you are trying to keep out of the game has pretty much killed it for me. LoL used to be my favorite game back in S1/S2. I rarely play it anymore and your post on Renekton is pretty much the exact reason for that. Intentionally dictating to players what they can play is unacceptable.



Agree with this guy completely.

Attachment 932927
(I'm going to regret this reply, I can see it now).

I'm not going to talk about the inflammatory stuff like "bias" or anything, as I'm never going to win over your heart Ralik. Instead, I'll try to clarify because I did put my foot in my mouth here.

I should have let Statikk explain this as I'm pretty sure I made a mess of the concept. The idea shouldn't be that Renekton is overpowered and that's fine because it's not Darius/etc, it should be because it's whack-a-mole up there (whether inadvertently or purposefully, there's a state of "top pick" on top that we will most definitely effect either through action or inaction).

This is part of the tradeoffs discussion - what do champs have as strengths and weaknesses? Right now, the answers are poor for most fighters. I'll have Statikk talk more about this one.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 01:54 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
27 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by hashinshin View Post
Kha'zix's recent "nerfs" ended up being buffed. Now he can often straight up 1v1 the bruisers/tanks that are supposed to be your can of raid. Big nukes + slow -> stealth -> repeat 2x more.
I'll have to review - was at GDC last week.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 01:53 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
26 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Servant Reaper View Post
@Morello:

I don't think I'm alone in being confused by the released iteration of the Kassadin changes. It's not so much "qq, Kassadin got nerfed" for me as it is that I'm not really sure what the champion's identity and playstyle is anymore. I've tried building him the same (which turned out poorly and made me unable to deal enough damage to kill anyone, even adjusting my playstyle to account for new w) and building him like Ryze (in hopes that I could AoE DPS the enemy team with 2s CD ult in lategame, which also turned out poorly, because my early game was just as bad as when I built like old Kass). It's kind of gotten to the point where I'm thinking Kass shouldn't build mana at all, and should just build AP and accept that his ult is utility-only and heavily gated. = /

Can you shed any light on what new Kass is balanced to do?
When we were testing it, he was doing it by using his really short CD ult to dart in and out opportunistically to snag kills with W and lichbane. He's supposed to be more mobile than burst, in this new version.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 01:52 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
25 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2hot2trotsky View Post
id like to ask, what are your stances on my 2 favorite champions since they're both relatively popular right now

kha'zix - the recent balance changes to kha'zix ended up making him harder to deal with then he was in patch 4.3, he does slightly less damage, but is much more survivable in teamfights, instead of readjusting his powerlevel i feel you guys were more then justified to just overall lowering his total power in the game (so long as you maintain whats awesome about him, his predatory feel and high damage) im assuming we'll either see reversions to his buffs last patch, or nerfs somewhere else.

Wukong - this was my 1st champion, i jungled him all through season 2 and 3 and he got really really really strong in season 4, with how the pantheon nerfs are looking on the PBE it's got me worried for my favortie monkey.

what are some concerns you guys have with wukong and kha'zix? do they have problematic aspects in their kits? this is a topic i would very much like to discuss with a red, and ask questions about, help me see what you guys see, as a designer (game design is something im incredibly fascinated and passionate about, especially within the league)
I actually think Kha'Zix is one of the better assassin patterns in our game. He hits hard, has good mobility, but is pretty subject to getting caught and killed. His pulsing stealths and leap can let him weave around a fight well too. I just think he's numerically too good if anything.

Ever since we've shifted his power off ranged and into melee, I've though Kha'Zix is a good assassin pattern to have. It has quite a bit of gameplay and is satisfying to use.

Wukong - I like his W a lot. I like his utility for his team in R. That's all the nice things I can say for Wukong


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 01:49 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
24 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darius the Great View Post
@Morello (Should you care to respond of course)


Can you tell us any about where the Darius rework is at right now (Aside from the tenative ideas you posted a while back)?


Thank you,


-DtG
I put the thread up in the community beta to get people's thoughts. It's in testing now.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 01:49 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
23 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by LucifronSun View Post
Does this mean champs like vladimir will be properly dealt with, perhaps reworked, instead of being left in a completely unsavory state for years? Hell, rengar is a fairly new champion and he got a rework way ahead of vlad, and he wasn't as gamebreaking.
The backlog's pretty big; I think Vlad's at least playable, if a little niche.

It does mean when we do new ones, we'll be following up on them if a real "kneecap" is required. The reworks team will be working closely with the balance guys to get the backlog of less-emergency champs (Heimer for an somewhat-recent example) sorted out.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
3 Weeks Ago 01:44 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

3 Weeks Ago
22 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckethead View Post
I disagree entirely, and I sincerely believe it would be a travesty to do anything with Nidlaee's Q in her current state.

Nidalee's only reliable damage (AP Nidalee, anyways)in human form is her spear, so it's natural that all of her kits power would be loaded into it. Think of other champions that have two or three damage abilities? Do they not deal damage equivalent to what a single Nidalee spear will do? There's nothing wrong with the skill as it exists, especially due to the considerable skill and awareness the AP Nidalee player must possess in order to land said spears at a long enough range to deal the significant damage you see from big spears. Even if it's just a guy spamming them, it's the fault of the player on the receiving end for not being properly prepared and able to deal with the skillshot coming towards them. Why would you punish a player for landing a skillshot? Isn't that entirely against any and all design principles you have put forth, Morello? (IE Xerath, Regar Rework, that pitiful rework known as current Skarner, etc.)

The rest of her power is shifted into her cougar form abilities, which are DANGEROUS for a squishy caster(thanks for nerfing those free resists by the way, CLEARLY a good design decision.) with little to no ability to get away past a single gap closer that will put you into MELEE range without any hope of escape should things go down **** creek. You land the spear, and rush in to melee range and try to finish someone off, because Nidalee doesn't have a finishing ability in human, other than land another spear, which lets face it, is going to be significantly tougher now that the target is on high alert and doing their best to avoid being in range of said spear.

So why punish them, Morello? Do you just dislike champions that deal their damage in high burst? Is that why you continue to nerf ever single assassin in the game? There's no reason for this, and I would really like to know what reasoning you might have, if any, for wanting to change an incredibly high skill cap champion just because they have all of their reliable damage on one ability.

Even given all that, why nerf, Morello? Is there really no way to bring champions of a similar type to a certain bar? Just because Yasuo/Grag/etc are strong mid laners that deal quite a bit of damage, is it really so bad that they do that? Must you really continue to nerf them just to try to get others to see play? Just set a level you want them to be at, and attempt to bring others to that level.

If you make a product, but then make a SUPERIOR product, do you really make the superior product more inferior so that the other inferior products look like they shine? That sounds like poor business practice, and poor balance. Just set a bar and bring them to that bar. It's ok to shift power around in kits, but I don't think that it's ok to just make them worse for the sake of trying to make others LOOK like they're better. If you bring them to a similar level it should seriously increase diversity. Do we want to run a fast siege comp with tower pushers like Xin and Malz? Or maybe we want to run a late game comp with Amumu and MF? If you look at your history, you will see that your greatest successes have come from bringing champions to a specific level and leaving them (Elise, Lee Sin, Caitlyn, Renekton,etc.) They don't just have versatility, they have lasting power because you don't destroy them with a patch (Graves, Rework Sejuani, Corki, Rework Kasseriouslywhatwereyouthinkin-adin, etc.)

If you can find a legitimate reason for not bringing them to an even bar I would love to seriously hear it, because as it sits you're just on your way to make all abilities just be particle effects and auto attacks deal no damage. No I don't think "power creep" is a good excuse, because power won't "creep" if you don't run everything up to insane numbers.
Nidalee spears are fun, satisfying and take skill. That's good. They also basically will eventually hit with good players involved because you can throw SO many of them. If Nid's had an OK game, then that spear will throw a teamfight into a big swing after just one good hit. This is good if there's a window, some downtime, something. Right now, it's so constant and so impactful, it removes the real tradeoff to the skill. It's a simple cooldown problem to me (and to finish, shouldn't you have to commit a little? Should you be a "ranged assassin"?

Because if we brought a character up to Gragas, we'd have to overload them and remove their downsides - this is the part that's so damning about these designs. You're seeing at as a buffs/nerfs axis, which is not the axis to look at here. What matters is "what do champions give up for their strengths". Most really dominant characters answer with "very little."

You can dislike adding tradeoffs as we do it, but I think it's critical; afterall, how does a character with tradeoffs get balanced against one without if they're roughly the same overall power? That's really tough to do when reliability and consistency is so important in good play - or on the other side, you risk those characters having to be completely flat to support their multitude of power sets. Elise is one of the most terrible examples, as she's the poster child for this stuff. Only via bad scaling is she not a complete mess.


IP: what is NOT a problem and what IS a problem BuboBubo
4 Weeks Ago 10:03 PM
General Discussion

BuboBubo

Business Analyst

4 Weeks Ago
4 of 4 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solatoral View Post
People that already have over 50k IP won't mind (in my opinion).
I think a lot of people would expect full refunds. Even for the limited rune balance changes we made this was a sentiment among a decent chunk of players. This has big implications - not saying its a good or bad call, just not one that can/should be made without very very careful consideration.

(OFFICIAL DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT SAYING RIOT WOULD /WOULD NOT GIVE FULL REFUNDS - I AM NOT MAKING ANY OFFICIAL STATEMENTS - PLEASE DON'T QUOTE THIS IN SOME FAR AWAY FUTURE DATE AND HOLD EVERYONE RESPONSIBLE). I hope its somewhat telling that I feel compelled to make this disclaimer.


IP: what is NOT a problem and what IS a problem BuboBubo
4 Weeks Ago 09:57 PM
General Discussion

BuboBubo

Business Analyst

4 Weeks Ago
3 of 4 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by helios the red View Post
read it all and you make very valid points, but you only focus on the lower levels. what about the lvl 25-30s that have to farm ip for a week to buy a 6300 champion?
Good point - the problems around IP aren't static, they do change depending on your level/how much you have already unlocked

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiyoSpirit View Post
I'm fine with that as long as new player get to choose whether they want the 450 champs or not. There are some champions I got for free that I really don't like having in my roster, and there are probably a number of people that feel the same.
While people may agree/disagree with this particular statement, it is a good example of people wanting choice. We have a lot of players with a ton of view points so even something that seems super obviously correct to a group of players may seem obviously incorrect to another. This doesn't mean no changes will be made, but its a good example of even if we do right by a majority, large numbers (hundreds of thousands if not millions) may be unhappier as a result. Just wanted to call this out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Schtiffles View Post
I think that's actually an issue for some people already.
Definitely. Right now it is still a small minority but it will become an increasingly common issue. And since these are most likely some very dedicated players it's definitely a player pain we should try and get ahead of.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyBaffler View Post
Is it possible to make free week champions come with a default rune page that you can use? This'll further help new players with learning the champ's optimal capacity.
I think this would be difficult to do in our current setup. I am sure its technically possible but there are probably easier approaches that achieve something "close enough". But please keep the suggestions coming!


Skarner Rework Follow Through RiotScruffy
4 Weeks Ago 09:20 PM
General Discussion

RiotScruffy

Game Designer

4 Weeks Ago
27 of 28 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by P Chro View Post
First off: Thank you for coming back to comment in this thread.

Second: Did you, by any chance, look at this rework I came up with while trying to take a similar approach to the rework as it (appeared) that you did? I wouldn't call it perfect but I believe it would play more like the old Skarner for those of us that really miss that style of play.
Ya, interesting stuff in your rework. One issue I could see happening with your suggested changes are that his slow is totally dependent on the shield holding, which can lead to him getting a really long really powerful slow or almost no slow at all.


Skarner Rework Follow Through RiotScruffy
4 Weeks Ago 07:38 PM
General Discussion

RiotScruffy

Game Designer

4 Weeks Ago
26 of 28 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by CamoClad View Post
Wait, is Morello trying to say that perhaps Riot made a mistake or two on the Skarner rework and that they are using it as a learning experience so as not to make those same mistakes again? Hmmmm, perhaps progress is being made in this thread :-)If so I say well played Morello.
To speak to what we have learned from the work so far on Skarner, we targeted making changes that would positively affect the gameplay and interactions on the character but didn't go far enough on improving him in ways that make him an exciting and unique character. We tried to keep the scope of the changes smaller to preserve as much of Skarner's current gameplay as we could but we think that in the end he will need some more upgrades to be a character that we can all be excited about.

In the present and immediate future, we will keep balancing Skarner and make sure he's a viable pick. You should definitely expect to be able to play Skarner and be successful. In the long term Skarner could go for some changes that bring some more excitement and uniqueness to his kit.


IP: what is NOT a problem and what IS a problem BuboBubo
4 Weeks Ago 07:08 PM
General Discussion

BuboBubo

Business Analyst

4 Weeks Ago
2 of 4 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spreek View Post
I'd rather just remove runes altogether (or make them free)
Say we wanted to make runes free going forward, what would you do with all the IP people have accrued? What about future IP earning rates? Keep in mind that players have different amounts of champions/runes/outstanding IP and we'd prefer not to greatly upset them if we can help it/unless its really really worth it.


IP: what is NOT a problem and what IS a problem BuboBubo
4 Weeks Ago 07:03 PM
General Discussion

BuboBubo

Business Analyst

4 Weeks Ago
1 of 4 Riot Posts

Thank you for a great post. Well written, well thought out, acknowledges pros and cons while giving clear suggestions on things that could be better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Menea6587 View Post
meaningful decision making
I strongly agree with your emphasis on meaningful decision making. While I am not on the design team personally, a lot of their changes suggest that this is a goal that is important to them. Some examples: constant references to counterplay, rebalancing runes and champions that they believe are crowding out other champions. Regardless of what you think about the specific changes, this seems like a plausible underlying rationale.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menea6587 View Post
drastically reduces the number of choices you have as a new player... These design decisions are not wrong or right. they either agree with the designers' philosophies or they don'
New players are definitely a special category. For me personally, learning league WAS overwhelming. But other players may be better with the high amount of choices and feel that slowly opening up the set of choices is frustratingly restricting. I agree with you that both sides have a valid point. There is likely room for improvement here but the current state isn't horrendous.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Menea6587 View Post
Additionally, knowing that there is no "wrong" choice but only "better" choices helps tremendously.
This one is tricky because League is primarily played competitively and so a lot of players are going to min-max. There is good reasoning here (make the highest expected value choices) but sometimes it gets incorrectly applied (eg: When people play a champ considered OP even when though it might be a sub optimal choice for THEM). The problem with runes is that even when you can earn an edge through rune choices the delta is small (intentional) and subtle. Its also made worse because unlocking runes takes a lot of time and isn't rewarding in the same way a champion is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Menea6587 View Post
Here are some ideas to address these shortcomings:
These seem like solid suggestions but it is not my area of expertise so I can't dive deep but some quick notes:

Suggestion 4: The idea of batch unlocking of runes slots and masteries is interesting - most games I have played do it incrementally but there is some value here. It probably won't be a game changer either, but certainly worth considering.

Suggestion 5: I also like the idea of just granting some basic runes as you level up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Menea6587 View Post
[*]I like warm hugs.
Me too man, me too. /Hug


Rengar Rework Strikes Back RiotScruffy
4 Weeks Ago 06:16 PM
General Discussion

RiotScruffy

Game Designer

4 Weeks Ago
48 of 48 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by RadiantWings View Post
The idea I have for Q is to make it more than a glorified auto-attack from ranking up. Instead of giving Empowered Q the aspd steroid, how about making the aspd steroid for Empowered abilities period and then boost its effect with ranks in Q?
We are actually specifically decoupling the empowered abilities from the base ability rank ups so that all 3 empowered abilities are a possible choice regardless of what skills you are leveling.


Rengar Rework Strikes Back RiotScruffy
4 Weeks Ago 05:15 PM
General Discussion

RiotScruffy

Game Designer

4 Weeks Ago
44 of 48 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Talohmiir View Post
Scruffy, I've red alot in the PBE forums, do you guys have any plans for Q? I keep hearing that it feels lackluster and where you guys had wanted people to feel they could level one ability depending on situation, everyone has been saying they level Q last because it just seems weak. I love the Cooldown time on it, but without any AS boost at all, it seems to weak, and that the level 2 power spike is gone. Just wondering what your opinions and reasoning are on this skill. Thanks.
We put in some changes over the weekend that will make the base Q feel better (faster next attack after base q by 40%). It was definitely feeling a bit sluggish.

Q is actually better for leveling than people think: the lowered cooldown is a really big deal. At higher ranks Q becomes a ferocity machine which creates more opportunities for Rengar to make big moves with the ferocity abilities. I still rank Q first, but I wouldn't say W and E are bad choices but they are just more defensive.


Rengar Rework Strikes Back RiotScruffy
4 Weeks Ago 04:50 PM
General Discussion

RiotScruffy

Game Designer

4 Weeks Ago
43 of 48 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Longshadow213 View Post
I think he's fine now, he can still double Q at the very least, and they never said he couldn't. The only thing I don't like is that he just flat out loses ferocity. That's not really adding counterplay, just making his ganks worse for not really any good reason.
In the end we removed the ferocity decay that we had tried out at first. The preparation element of choosing when and how to enter a gank/fight was actually a really cool and strategic element that we felt Rengar lost with the changes.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 04:00 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
21 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Groxxy View Post
What's an exampl of a "false" weakness in a character?
What's an example of a "true" or "good" weakness in a character?
A false weakness would be Nasus' early game. He ramps up, so his Q looks like it'd be bad early game/good late, but the high sustain makes this not matter. Nasus plays what game he's going to play, and the opponent is window dressing to that.

A true weakness would be Kog'Maw's mobility. He plays like a sniper in FPS - untouchable in his zone, and defenseless in yours. This makes Kog have good contextual power overall, and makes him a healthy champion.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:50 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
20 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamandis View Post
Any chances Diana will be getting a rework this year then?
I actually have a position that numbers and role shifting can get her there. Want to give it a shot.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:48 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
19 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Explosion View Post
Strategic uniqueness. Something only that champion can do.

You may have a trouble in this 'class' and 'role' system in that the champions fitting those global descriptions become interchangeable.

You don't pick Jayce because he's doing something only he can do, you pick him if and because he does something the rest of his class does only better.

Pretty please Morello work on this.

You've already begun trending toward more early community feedback and more inter-group coordination as I've recommended-- that shared strategic vision system will perhaps allow you to more easily 'compare notes' on how to make each champion 'stand out' in the game.
I super-duper agree with this. One thing nice about roles - when you know these fundamentals for your game, then you can let someone violate them on purpose to really stand out - something Ashe characterizes really well.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:46 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
18 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Critkeeper View Post
You do realize that the problem which plagues light fighters isn't their individual kits, but their lack of itemization options right?

A light fighter by definition is a fighter that survives by using tricks and skills rather than brute force. There is no itemization to support that paradigm for AD caster or AD fighters. AP light fighters like fizz can exist because of zhonyas hourglass.

Fix the itemization issue and allow us to purchase survivability without purchasing massive amounts of resists and health, and you will see people in competitive play playing without purchasing a huge amount of resists and health. If you do that, then the metagolem problem that plagues top laners and bruisers will diminish automatically.

Otherwise you end up with 2 dozen light fighters that are inferior to yasuo, who is healthy and has an appropriate amount of power because he has the elements in his kit to survive his own shenanagins.

A long time ago Tryndamere and Yi had the elements they needed to survive their own dives. Now they don't because the game changed around them, the environment is filled with much more CC and durability. Yasuo will experience the same phenomena eventually.

Just give us items we can purchase that says "I can survive longer now if I use this active correctly". I don't wanna be roped into building 250 armor or building a gimmicky 2-shot-u-before-u-can-react build.
I think this is true only of light fighters, who have a role on the team (Have you been talking to Xypherous? He's been calling these guys light fighters and classifying it similarly too). What do other guys do in a teamfight? Everything? I think that's the problem on the majority. And that will hold light fighters back even if they did have the right items, because all your darting around and moving about just bounces off or gets punished by characters who overwhelm.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:44 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
17 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starlighte View Post
I don't think it really addresses the WHY of "Why can't we get more frequent balance changes?" Especially if it is, at the very least, addressing the balance aspect vrs. the unhealthy champion design problem? Realistically, there should be nothing gating a week or two's worth of testing before balance changes go live. I think we all understand changes not being made to certain champions that essentially "Olaf" them until you get around to giving them some healthy gameplay.

So the question still stands, and though I appreciate your response Morello, I don't feel it answers the question I am really asking.
Patches are complicated also. If we don't have them finalized in time for ALL the logistics to go out to a patch worldwide (we really think it's important everyone playing LoL is playing the same game, functionally). So uncertainty on said testing (limited by time themselves - testing is the hugest indicator of how much we can get done) will push something back a patch, which can be a few more weeks.

I think some of this is necessary to making a game, we used to have this problem back in the day too.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:41 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
16 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Better Ban Sona View Post
Oh and while you are here, what is your current position on the state of sustain supports such as Sona and Soraka?

A few months ago you spoke on the lack of itemization for them, as well as the dominance on Annie in bottom lane. I still feel like my favorite champs are being held back from playing a prominent role in this game, though I understand the problems they cause when they were allowed to be strong. What are the plans for sustain supports in the future?
Sustain supports are not the classification I look at, but the "traditional" support (more helping with direct spells) do need better itemization. Right now, actives weaken the identity of supports (by the end of the game, top games have as many bought skills as not) as you're best picking someone who can win lane and is a great vehicle for these powerful, necessary effects.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:37 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
15 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alorasence View Post
If there are times when you feel unsure about what to change balance-wise with a champion, or your team has differing opinions on what to do, please tell us.

In the patch notes, if we read why you chose not to change something that we feel should have been changed, mention it.

When champions like Annie go so long without being seriously attended to, we start to wander if you are aware of her being a problem. (the latest changes may in fact haver her in line, but she went nearly 6 months supplanting other caster-supports)


Share your thoughts, even when they don't immediately lead to changes.
Noted - good idea.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:37 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
14 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Naphares View Post
Sounds like every rework they've done lately. Olaf, Kassadin, Pantheon changes, and upcoming Gragas 'rework' (read: butchering)..

Great job, dudes.
If you consider Kassadin and Grags butchering, you basically will hate 95% of changes to this game when we are doing them right.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:36 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
13 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Argent Heretic View Post
Well, l wish you guys took this more into consideration before you spayed Diana. Despite the buffs she is still sitting at like 41%+- winrate. Don't you think those nerfs were a little harsh? She is hardly viable in high Elo for both solo que and team. Do you guys have any plans to fix this?
I actually have a direction on this that might be stupid, and likely is. Let me figure out how dumb it is via testing and I'll have more information :P

The real question is: Is Diana an assassin or a bruiser? That distinction chooses which fixes to go with. Items allowing for both is a nice thing to do, if possible, but I can't put all my chips on that #.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:33 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
12 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vahlenx View Post
......Later that day "Morello: Alright we've broken Pantheon's knee-caps, where are we at in breaking Wu's arms?"
lol


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:30 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
11 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by NineTales9 View Post
explains why Pantheon is getting olaf'd and Rengar rework is making him even weaker than he is already. neither of them need the immediate attention you speak of, Renekton and Gragas do
Renekton is complicated. I won't do this one justice as much as Statikk will, but I'll give it my best.

Basically, Renekton is very dominant. He's the standard we judge power by. That's clearly something that's not good. The issue is that Renekton is the least-bad result on who that can be, and we have a lot of fears that who comes in and replaces him would be as dominant and even more of a mess. Again, this is one that requires some insight from dudes on the ground here - we do think Rene is the lesser of multiple evils in the short-term (and long-term role definitions for fighters take time).

Reworks (Rengar) aren't intended to just buff characters. I think Kassadin's is a good model (and the best learning from what's wrong on Skarner), though. It should communicate why you should be excited about playing the champion, and the current one might not be there yet. Though we're not looking to just buff his existing pattern.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:26 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
10 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaotic KO View Post
dont nerf lee please!
We're looking to pair back on Lee to just do the W change first (IE you can actually catch him, it punishes mistakes well, and makes the team-oriented case more important in relation) and keep watch on the state of him sans Vi and Elise as domineering junglers.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:25 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
9 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizel View Post
When "Re-working" Gragas, why is it necessary to destroy AD Bruiser Gragas? Why is it unhealthy to change the Tank/Hybrid nature of his kit to a full AP kit? wouldn't have made more sense to nerf the AP ratios and base damage even further but compensate by giving him small buffs to the Tank/bruiser side of things?
When looking at Grags, we had to make a choice. Most of Gragas' unique functionality was that of a great tank. That's not really compatable with a good burst.

In this case, this is due to:

1) Grag's ult is a huge utility move. If it does high damage and utility, we'd have had to make it unreliable. Tanks, on the other hand, do need some stability in their engage or fight-starting pattern.

2) Gragas is a fat guy with a barrel. It is a bit weird if he's not tough (and toughness/time to kill should be inversely related).

3) It allowed us to put more utility functions on his kit, since most tanks need that. This coincides with the big team-related plays and functions Gragas already provides.

In essence, it's because they were mutually exclusive, and for the reasons above, we chose tank.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:21 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
8 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Servaetes View Post
With the ridiculous amount of accusations/hate Ghostcrawler has gotten from GD AND Reddit without even saying anything I'm not sure he'd want to, honestly. I don't even think the guy has had a chance to formally introduce himself.
Hilariously, GC even has less impact and interaction on game balance here as he's focused on helping on other areas (ie most of the ones I don't spend a lot of time with!) I chuckle when I see him get blamed for unpopular nerfs - getting blamed for that is my job!


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:19 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
7 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starlighte View Post
I'll try and phrase this as non-combative as possible even though this is something I am highly passionate about. Is there any reason that balance changes are being released at the rate they are? The community, and seemingly rioters all agree that the balance changes are NOT coming out fast enough, nor are they being well-executed. I don't think any of us are going to claim that the days back in S1-S2 Riot's balance was better, but it seemed to be a lot more consistent at least.

Riot in general says, "We realize we did this wrong, and could do it better. And we are going to do it better in the future." But honestly, with the issue of patches being as slow as they are, it seems unlikely that we will ever see progress made in improving the feedback/response loop because of timeline problems.

So the biggest question I've got is why are balance changes taking such an excruciatingly long time?
And on a smaller note, why can't we get faster updates, such as every other week for balance changes?
See my second post here - I think the reasons are similar (where it's a balance/vs unhealthy champion design problem).


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:18 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
6 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by GodBroJ View Post
so you guys are fixing that bs pantheon ult change?
We're still messing with Pantheon. PBE is for the kind of feedback we get there!


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:18 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
5 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaltyTeemo4Life View Post
@Morello

I have a question for you.
Do riot have a plan regarding nidalle? Her current state is toxic to the game i think it would be reasonable to shift her power from Q to cougar form or make missing a Q punishing by larger cd if it dont hit the champion or simply increase the mana cost of this skill.
Not prioritized, but we totally agree here. This is the exact breakdown we see in what's wrong with Nidalee.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:16 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
4 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerminalVeloc1ty View Post
thanks for taking the time to read this

It's never fun being nerfed to an underpowered state. And at the same time it's not fun having a favorite champion who's being locked out of play due to a much stronger competitive pick.

I do have one question for you.

When you guys do decide to nerf something, is it possible to give us a heads up that you ARE looking at doing some nerfing for champions? You don't have to say what you're nerfing or give a really detailed communication thread about it.

But a simple "X champion is going to get looked at because we've seen that it's doing bad things to the game" or something.
I think this is a good point - how much of the harshness with this stuff is the surprise of it? While we have tons of conversations and tracking on what we're doing and why, you guys are just seeing "here's some changes!" This makes the first blush reaction not set up to be super good. :P


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:14 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
3 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Scruffz View Post
1 Question while you're around Morello, will GhostCrawler ever interact with the community or is a strictly behind the scenes guy?
I'd have to ask him - that's really up for him to decide. He's working less on day-to-day than even I am, so probably where it makes sense.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:13 PM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
2 of 35 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by kay faraday View Post
All in all,I always feel Riot makes the right decisions in the end,even if sometimes it doesn't feel good.
Tell me Morello,can I ask you if there are any champ who requires an immediate attention/are closely looked at, at the moment?
I think Pantheon is a high-profile one that does. The real solution (time and art bandwidth not withstanding) would be to modify a skill like Q to have more gameplay. In the meantime, we will have to address power. Some of the PBE stuff is a first swipe at that, but we're still discussing the right changes.

I think one of the biggest weaknesses we've had is appropriate follow-through. "Olafing" being the best example of this. Let's go on a journey...

When we need to nerf something that has huge game-warping implications, this can be pretty straight-forward if the champion in question has otherwise good gameplay and is overtuned. We can basically do a lot of work to look at the number tuning, modify over time and generally get it right.

Where this is really hard is champions who are binary in their power: either strong enough you must pick them, or not (which leads to never using the champion). Most of the champions are characterized by poor tradeoffs in their kit, or "false" weaknesses - weaknesses that don't effect the champion much.

So, in these cases, we need to do something fast to make sure other people can be used, but we also have a lot to fix to make sure the character has tradeoffs and can be strong or weak depending on the context of the game, player skill comparisons, matchups, and other factors.

My assessment of what makes players the most frustrated and makes us lose trust is right here. If we had good follow-through here consistently, players (who tend to be reasonable more often than not) then would probably go "this sucks now, but I get it - OK, this will get us to a better place."

This is something I'm...let's say passionate...about fixing this year. It's not due to lack of desire, but lack of ability to always prioritize the right things. Gragas' changes should be a much clearer window of the world we want to live in.


@Morello/Ghostcrawler - Please Nerf responsibly. Morello
4 Weeks Ago 03:15 AM
General Discussion

Morello

Lead Designer

4 Weeks Ago
1 of 35 Riot Posts

We agree; we never want to go overboard on something unless there's something that demands immediate attention. We've not been consistent about this from an execution standpoint, and a lot of that is due to not centralizing how we make these decisions enough.

This essentially means that since we've been working more "loosely", we've had some problems all getting on the same page (or how to, sometimes!) with each other on how to best address certain problems. This creates inconsistency, which makes it hard to tell where smoke leads to fire for players. This makes it hard to parse feedback on our end, since players don't have a good rubric to look at what changes will pan out and which ones might be too far.

With some better communication and consistency on our part, I think we can nerf more appropriately for a problem. Of course we will make changes for the reasons you mentioned, but I think we can do better on execution. I'd like the results of this to speak for themselves a bit in the next several months.


Mac client crashing Brentmeister
4 Weeks Ago 10:37 AM
Mac Client

Brentmeister

Associate Software Engineer

4 Weeks Ago
3 of 5 Riot Posts

Thanks for the additional logs guys! We have a few leads we have the team looking into.


[ Wall of Text WARNING ]
Addressing the support complaints. I did check with the Player Support guys before my first response to this thread to see if we'd gotten an increase in Maestro related issues on the Mac. They said it didn't seem like anymore than usual.

"Anymore than usual"?!?!?! Let me just say that given the size of our playerbase I have seen players machines break in every way possible. Maestro breaks for instance if you've disabled/broken/overloaded the loopback on your network card. I've seen it break due to viruses(botnets)/hacks to get photoshop working/people downloading corrupted/specialized network drivers/firewall configurations/etc...
I can assure you that we test Mac thoroughly before every release. We have dozens of different macs sweeped EVERYDAY, MULTIPLE TIMES. Does this mean every configuration? Of course not. It does mean however, that it doesn't really make sense to treat every ticket like it's a massive bug in the client.

Our support department is there to help you guys but you have to work with them. I went ahead and checked in this one case because this statement didn't seem like our guys.
"I cannot provide any other solutions sets because unfortunately, I am not with you to diagnose this problem." Is horribly out of context.

[Full Context]
"Past that, I cannot provide any other solutions sets because unfortunately, I am not with you to diagnose your problem. I rely heavily on your cooperation to resolve this issue!" (He's requesting logs and not getting them)

The support team is there to help you with your issues but you have to provide them with information so they can help you troubleshoot. They are hardworking guys who want to get you back into games but it's hard to help someone who isn't providing you with enough information. From their perspective,
"oh hey this guy is experiencing issues but I just played fine on my Mac last night. Let's see if we can find out what is wrong together". They ask for information to eliminate and hone in on what may be the true cause.
In the case that they see an overwhelming pattern in the information they are receiving, they walk over to my desk and they say "Hey Brent, fix your ****. No one on Mac OSX 10.9.1 with this model macbook can play". [ This is when you get told it's a known issue. Maybe they could be more clear that someone is working on it? ]

Sorry if this got ranty but I really wanted to make it clear these guys work hard and are there to help you. They need your cooperation to succeed. Thank you for the feedback though, it's already got me thinking on how we can improve communication between departments and to players for known issues.


Mac client crashing Brentmeister
4 Weeks Ago 01:16 PM
Mac Client

Brentmeister

Associate Software Engineer

4 Weeks Ago
2 of 5 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by XSilentxRoarX View Post
mine is currently 4.4 from NA, and still crashing. here are the save logs. https://www.mediafire.com/?edxhhobx67ukp6c
Thanks for the logs!

It'd be helpful if more people experiencing the Maestro connection issue could post their logs as well after receiving the crash.


Compendium of Map Specific Champion Balance: Dominion ManWolfAxeBoss
4 Weeks Ago 10:01 AM
Dominion

ManWolfAxeBoss

QA Analyst

4 Weeks Ago
2 of 2 Riot Posts

Updated!


Gotta hug 'em all! Riot Ve1vet
4 Weeks Ago 04:04 PM
General Discussion

Riot Ve1vet

QA Analyst

4 Weeks Ago
22 of 25 Riot Posts

Ames is away on business but I will be sure to poke him when he gets back.

I would like to contribute as well! ٩(๑◡-๑)۶ⒽⓤⒼ❤


Gotta hug 'em all! Riot Reinboom
4 Weeks Ago 04:01 PM
General Discussion

Riot Reinboom

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Software Engineer

4 Weeks Ago
21 of 25 Riot Posts

*hug*

I have delivered your wish for a hug. The contract has started.

/人 ◕‿‿◕ 人\


"Plot is Highly Overrated" - Riot Narrative Lead Kades
4 Weeks Ago 05:05 PM
General Discussion

Kades

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Associate QA Analyst - Gameplay

4 Weeks Ago
2 of 6 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Clueless PhD View Post
The thing is, Kades, it looks to the players like this isn't out of context. From our perspective, it looks like not much care is had, because we don't really see much.

We know it's there. We do. I know how much work the Creative department puts in. But, at the end of the day, we don't see enough of it to make it obvious. Just a little while back, someone from Creative posted about how Lissandra was blinded by the Ursine. Thats an amazing detail. I would love to know more about that story. But, from what it looks like to us players, I never will. And I never would have heard that tidbit if I hadn't been browsing the forums at the time.

It seems to us that LoL's lore is basically a giant head canon. It's this rich universe that we never get to hear anything about. I'm sure it's there, and I would love to know more, but I can't.
That's fair. And I can get that's how you'd feel from the outside. It's just odd hearing that frustration directed at that specific guy. Like, "Mr. Rogers is such a jerk IRL!!!"

I gotta be really careful about extending expectations to a group that already feels pretty frustrated and slighted. But our Lore department isn't getting any smaller. We want to tell more stories, too. I'd be a bad fit for the 'Iron Stylus of Lore', but I can understand how you'd feel frustrated if you wanted to hear more and you thought we weren't listening.

I guess I'll just say that we are listening. And that we want to tell great stories rather than rush to tell lots of them.


"Plot is Highly Overrated" - Riot Narrative Lead Kades
4 Weeks Ago 04:52 PM
General Discussion

Kades

This user has referred a friend to League of Legends, click for more information

Associate QA Analyst - Gameplay

4 Weeks Ago
1 of 6 Riot Posts

You know, I'd taken a break from the forums for a bit- but this thread really befuddled me. I have that sick sensation right now- like I'm Bilbo Baggins wandering headlong into a den of trolls- but I'm genuinely confused so I might as well chime in.

Ryugi, you mentioned that you were considering applying for a 'Narrative Editor' position. I'm not really sure on the specifics of the role, but context clues lead me to think that it would have you working- at least somewhat- with our Narrative Lead. A guy that I feel very humbled to call a coworker. In all my interactions, Tom's been incredibly on-point and awesome to work alongside. A passionate dude who is always trying to find cool new ways to explore our lore. The type who will sit there and really try to listen and understand what you're saying before he responds. And from Bilgewater to Shurima to Ionia... he lives and breathes our lore. That entire team does.

He's a collaborator. In my interactions, he appears to lead by example. And he's far more talented than I am (though I suppose that last part's not saying too much...)

I gather by the tone of your post that you scrapped that idea to apply to Riot- which might be our loss- but from what you're showcasing, I'd struggle to see you thrive in an environment that you hold in such contempt. I don't know. From the small bit I've seen, you seem to also jump quickly to hyperbole and sensationalism (title of the thread?) Maybe that strategy has worked for you in the past?


Regardless, I think it's plausible that you took what he was saying about how 'plot is highly overrated in games' out of context. (That's reinforced by the fact that this discussion is based around an IGN article rather than a GDC video.)

For me, personally, as a fun of the lore- I tend to respond to more character explorations rather than plot driven thematics. That's what I took from his observations, too. The Jinx video would be considered a character exploration in the way I'm describing it; the old Journals of Justice (of which I've read them all...!) is the best example I can think of that showcases us trying to add plot into the world of Runeterra. The political intrigue was exciting for me, but I found that most people around me had to previously be really invested to care that... I don't know, 'Swain is now running Noxus'. Where as, I can show the Jinx video to a stranger and they get what Jinx is about. My wife only wants to play Jinx mainly due to the video.

'Great characters and a rich world create a canvas for players to explore a game- and it allows them to make their own plots.' That's what I took away from the talk.


You seemed to take 'Riot hates stories!' or 'Riot hates having lore!' which... I suppose is just a different way to go with it. And all the more confusing because it is so drastically far off from the truth.

I could debate the pro's and con's of Tom's GDC speech at length, but that's not really why I stopped by. I guess I just wanted to touch on one point- it seems like you are genuinely passionate about our lore. And I can appreciate that you care so much about it that you are upset you don't have more of it. I get that. But on that front, that dude you're raging about is not your enemy.

Frankly, he's one of your biggest allies.


Mac client crashing Brentmeister
4 Weeks Ago 11:58 AM
Mac Client

Brentmeister

Associate Software Engineer

4 Weeks Ago
1 of 5 Riot Posts

This issue can be caused if LoL Launcher crashes in the background while the Air Client is running. Are you getting a crash dialog for LoL Launcher?

If you are still experiencing this issue after the 4.4 patch lands can you please post your logs? Open the patcher, go to the gear in the upper right and select "Save Logs" then upload them here or on some upload site.

Thanks,

@ENIACK: Is it possible for you to post the System details for the machines that are affected and the one that is not?
You can get this information by going to [Apple Icon] -> About this Mac -> More Info -> System Report -> File -> Save


Gotta hug 'em all! Riot Hitstreak
4 Weeks Ago 09:23 AM
General Discussion

Riot Hitstreak

Social Media Coordinator

Follow Riot Hitstreak on Twitter

4 Weeks Ago
20 of 25 Riot Posts

Who am I to say no to such a noble quest..

*hug*

Good luck in chasing the rest of us down!


Summoner's Rift Detailed Art feedback RiotForScience
4 Weeks Ago 09:57 AM
Art Feedback

RiotForScience

Senior Environment Artist

4 Weeks Ago
70 of 82 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by exec3 View Post
@RiotForScience

I was watching OGN the other day and being stuck on medium quality because you have to pay for HD I was wondering if low quality streams was ever a factor when designing a map or content in general? What I mean is do you make sure that your art is designed to be clear and visible with low resolution streams in mind or is that not a concern?

We try to design in large graphical shapes that are clearly value-blocked. This is to improve gameplay readability in normal play. One of the side effects is that it would improve clarity in low-resolution as well. But no, we are not building with that concern in mind, it is getting resolved accidentally though.


Whom do you feel the most sorrow for? Jaredan
03-16-2014 08:44 PM
Lore Discussion

Jaredan

Senior Editor

03-16-2014
1 of 1 Riot Posts

Quote:
Originally Posted by SonaGaveMeABona View Post
A champion that, whenever you read their tale, you can't help but feel a sense of sadness that this happened to them. That they truly didn't deserve their fate that was bestowed.

My choices vary between Nautilus, who I think is truly suffering underneath all that armor, & Amumu, who only wants to feel like he belongs somewhere, and not be sad anymore.

Poor 'mumu.
I agree with the marvelous thoughts by those who have already posted. As Iraeavin and IMTOOJUICY commented, Lux is a character who might have reservoirs of turmoil beneath that infectious enthusiasm. Her bio outlines that she was turned from socialite to superspy while still a kid. She survives those perilous adventures and has the strength of mind to seek another path. And yet, that Garen fellow still wears big shoes and casts a long shadow.

The most obvious ones for me would be Lucian and Yasuo, both have lost the most significant relationship of their lives due to the actions of others. Yasuo was, of course, an impetuous tyke, but it doesn't get more grim than having to cut down your own brother.

Olaf has always struck me as quite a tragic character, though he might not see himself that way. Essentially, the only thing he is terrified of is having a long and peaceful life. By extension, he would most likely avoid anything that would lead down that path, such as falling in love, having kids, and so on.

I know he would be too busy ripping through monstrous creatures like a blender to pause for those thoughts, but, from my perspective, it seems a tremendously sad and lonely life. Imagine that the bones in the fire spoke true and decades of seeking the ultimate adversary ends with Olaf passing from Runeterra peacefully on a death bed. Perhaps he is surrounded by a loving family he resents completely, or he is just attended by his own sense of complete failure.

The alternative is he gets what he wants: evisceration by something so awful, even he cannot survive it.

Yeesh.